Max Kellerman says Usyk is a historically overrated heavyweight, do you agree?

Well said!

 

Too many if's. I just feel it's wrong to recategorize the past fighters to fit your argument. They did what they did during their time. Who knows, if the cruiserweight division never came into existence, Usyk may be considered the greatest light heavyweight of all time.

 

hes right. as ive said before, a few years back fury was the goat. before that it was loma. and the next one will be here before 2030. its actually amusing, the emotional energy put into the pattern. eventually it gets sorted out.

 

serge , you can talk all night long but that does not change the fact that if we discuss usyk,s resume at heavy he indeed faced just 5 opponents . No top ranked hw guy has a thinner resume than him , e.g young itauma faced more than double opponents ( 11 ) than usyk ( 5 )

Kellermann is , based on facts , obviously right even when we do not like it .

on the other hand : his wins over aj are impressive without a doubt and his legacy at cruiser also .

There are plenty of opponents available and usyk should just fight them , even risking a honorable loss. being undefeated at heavy with 5 opponents does not mean much , most good boxers are undefeated with just 5 guys on the resume so he has little to loose here.

 

No he wouldn’t because that isn’t a a great accomplishment. You guys are embellishing Usyk’s brief heavyweight run.

Let’s see, Dubois was decimated by Joyce before Usyk faced him. AJ took a beating from a little fat man prior to facing Usyk. And Fury was in 3 wars with the most dangerous puncher that we had in decades. Even then, beating the cumbersome Wilder shouldn’t have shaken the world like it did.

Who’s the fastest fighter that Usyk beat?

 

Hold on,are you saying Moses resume is better? just because he has had 11 fights?

 

If we compare Usyk and Ali and his era, then we need to use the same measure. And then, as noted above, his record in the heavyweight division (Ali's era) would be 24-0 (30-0 if we count WSB). Based on this, we can say that he faced almost all types of heavyweights, both smaller and shorter ones, as well as much larger ones. Therefore, by the standards of Ali's era, he is a proven heavyweight with a long and varied career. In the modern era, he has a limited circle of opponents, but they are all of the highest level. One can conduct a thought experiment and imagine a heavyweight with a 3-0 record, but those three would be Ali, Foreman, and Frazier. How would one evaluate the career of this imaginary heavyweight?

 

Usyk defeated those whom, logically, he should have lost to. And all those legends lost to those they should have defeated. That's what fascinates me about him, that he has an iron will to win. It's like in old movies where a crowd that is vastly superior in numbers and skill is defeated by an unyielding will, one that even fate itself bows to. Please be forgiving, English is not my native language.

 

No , i,m just saying itauma has more than twice the amount of opponents at heavy than usyk . It highlights how thin usyk,s resume at heavy indeed is . I,m not saying itauma is better than usyk .

 

It doesn't. Nielsen's 49-0 isn't the same as Marciano's. It's considerably worse than 48-0 run Holmes went on. What it counts are not overall fights, but fights at the top level. Usyk has similar amount of fights against Top 10 guys to Foreman and Marciano. He doesn't need filler.

 

What other Heavyweight has beaten at the time the #1 Fury, #2 Joshua, #3 Dubois contenders not only once but TWICE? Who else has done that? Why did all of them deserve a second chance? The only one that was semi competitive in the first fight was Fury and even then it took a crooked referee to save him from getting knocked out. Your standards are ludicrous.

 

He won't even fight Frank Sanchez for christ sakes.

 

Like said , we can discuss and try to justify this all day long , but whatever we do , he stays at 5 opponents at heavy , thats a solid fact .

Even the quality was not that superb . Whitherspoon , old chisora , an incredible weak performance of dubois coming of a party , a way past peak fury who went hell with ngannou shortly before retirement ... for me if at all joshua was his best achievement.

usyk is an incredible skilled boxer , the best of his era , but his resume at heavy is indeed very weak . In no way he should get two undisputed hw fights with such a resume and of course any goat discussion is nonsense .

At cruiser on the other hand he was really a goat .

 

If taking the majority of fights at the level Uysk has had, Itauma wouldnt be at 11 fights

Use context ffs