Rank these fighters: Marciano, Finito, Calzaghe, Ward, Mayweather, Crawford

@Loudon your posts are too long. Marciano is simply greater than Mayweather, deal with it.

Somebody knowledgeable like Bert Sugar would laugh in your face for even suggesting that thecherry picking featherfist could be greater than Rocky.

 

Under traditional ranking criteria, Rocky can’t rank higher.


Ability:

It’s not even close, in favour of Floyd.


Overall resume:

Floyd has a much deeper resume


Wins:

Floyd has a better group of wins.


Accomplishments:

Floyd accomplished more.


Longevity:

Floyd had better longevity.


It’s easy to rank them.


Rocky was a great warrior. He deserves huge respect. But he fought in one of the weakest era’s in HW history, where his best competition were former MW’s-LHW’s, who had a ton of mileage.

 

Sorry mate, i meant to comment back many days ago. He's a bit under the weights i get excited about but he never had that defining fight and missed a couple of guys he needed to fight to make real waves.

 

Thanks mate.

I really appreciate the reply.

I’ll check him out.

 

Anytime mate. The knock on him is that he didn't step up and have a crack at Carbajal or Gonzalez. A win over these guys would have significantly raised his stock.

I hope you had a great Chistmas mate.

I did see your quote of me in the Monzon - Calze thread but just let your comments stand as it's a reasonably open debate on that topic.

 

This is all painting with a broad brush rubbish.

A few things to consider are...

Rocky fought at the glamour division, not bouncing around among the lesser divisions, picking fights here and there with catchweights and rehydration clauses, with a continual supply of passed their prime opponents who carried names with cache.

Rocky fit his 49 fights in 8 years, Floyd the same in 20 years.

What is more accomplished than winning the heavyweight championship and cleaning out the rankings?

Ability? Floyd played boxing. Rocky fought. I will take the ability to FIGHT over the ability to play boxing.

 

Yes, Rocky fought in the glamour division. However, it was in one of its weakest periods in history.

His greatest competition came from former MW-LHW’s, who had a ton of mileage.

Archie Moore was in his 40’s, where he’d fought close to 200 times.

So what you’ve written about Floyd, applies directly to Rocky.


Floyd was one of the most skilled fighters in history.

A true technician.


Rocky was very limited technically, but very strong.

He never outboxed anybody.

He overpowered them.

Out skilling someone is far more impressive.


Rocky deserves huge respect. But he wasn’t as skilled, and his resume and competition were lesser.

Therefore, he shouldn’t rank higher.

 

@Loudon seeing as though you like writing really overly long posts. Here's a long post for you.

It's Bert Sugars top 100 Greatest Ever Boxers list. Marciano is 14th, and I don't see how you could put Floyd over him

1. Sugar Ray Robinson
2. Henry Armstrong
3. Wille Pep
4. Joe Louis
5. Harry Greb
6. Benny Leonard
7. Muhammad Ali
8. Roberto Duran
9. Jack Dempsey
10. Jack Johnson
11. Mickey Walker
12. Tony Canzoneri
13. Gene Tunney
14. Rocky Marciano
15. Joe Gans
16. Sam Langford
17. Julio Cesar Chavez
18. Jimmy Wilde
19. Stanley Ketchel
20 Barney Ross
21, Jimmy McLarnin
22. Archie Moore
23. Marcel Cerdan
24. Ezzard Charles
25. Sugar Ray Leonard
26. Joe Walcott (The original)
27. Jake LaMotta
28. Eder Jofre
29. Emile Griffith
30. Terry McGovern
31. George Foreman
32. Johnny Dundee
33. Jose Napoles
34. Pascual Perez
35. Billy Conn
36. Ruben Olivares
37. Joe Frazier
38. Tommy Loughran
39. Sandy Saddler
40. Kid Chocolate
41. Abe Attell
42. Evander Holyfield
43. George Dixon
44. Maxie Rosenbloom
45. Larry Holmes
46. Ted "Kid" Lewis
47. Marvin Hagler
48. Pernell Whitaker
49. Carlos Zarate
50. Thomas Hearns
51. Battling Nelson
52. Beau Jack
53. Ricardo ;Lopez
54. John L. Sullivan
55. Carlos Monzon
56. Alexis Arguello
57. Carmen Basillio
58. Pete Herman
59. Charley Burley
60. Ike Williams
61. Kid Gavilan
62. Jack Britton
63. Dick Tiger
64. Pancho Villa
65. Panama Al Brown
66. Bob Fitszimmons
67. Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
68. Tiger Flowers
69. James J.Corbett
70. Tony Zale
71. Tommy Ryan
72. Georges Carpentier
73, Sonny Liston
74. "Kid" McCoy
75. Bob Foster
76. Freddie Welsh
77. Joe Jeanette
78. Jim Driscoll
79. Jersey Joe Walcott
80. Peter Jackson
81. Ad Wolgast
82. Jack Dempsey (The Nonpareil)
83. Manuel Ortiz
84. James J. Jeffries
85. Salvador Sanchez
86. Jimmy Barry
87. Carlos Ortiz
88. Roy Jones Jr.
89. Wilfredo Gomez
90. Aaron Pryor
91. Bernard Hopkins
92. Mike Gibbons
93. Jack Delaney
94. Johnny Kilbane
95. Willie Ritchie
96. Wilfredo Benitez
97. Packey McFarland
98. Rocky Graziano
99. Lew Jenkins
100. Mike Tyson

 

If you want an objective debate, we can have one.

I respected Burt a lot.

I used to watch all of his shows.

I’ve also read his books and listened to countless interviews.

Ranking fighters will always be subjective.

But even so, I’ve always preferred to rank on traditional criteria.

It’s the most objective way.

Ability
Resume
Wins
Accomplishments
Longevity

There’s other things to consider of course, but they’re the main 5 factors.

Now what criteria did Burt use?

Because I recall him having had a friendly on air argument with one of his guests. It may have been Holmes.

Burt said that Joe Louis should rank higher than Ali.

I’m sure it was Holmes, although I’d have to check.

Holmes said that IHHP, Ali should rank higher, because he was better than Louis, he had a better resume, a better group of wins, and he’d have won a H2H fight had they have fought.

Yet Burt just laughed, and said “That’s apples to oranges, and Louis was more dominant in his era, therefore he was the best”

Well, yes. He was more dominant in his era.

But then if you apply context, his era was weaker than Ali’s.

Both of them laughed.

They were great shows.

Regarding his list, I respect it, but I don’t agree with it.

IMHO, Langford and Moore are too low, and Rocky is way too high.

Also, how on earth can Rocky rank higher on a P4P list than Archie Moore??

There’s no way that he can rank higher.

And I don’t care if he beat him.

Nobody ranks Marvin and Hearns higher than Duran.

 

Just simply tell me what criteria you specifically use.