Vasyl Lomachenko vs Shakur Stevenson: Who wins?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Flo_Raiden, May 11, 2024.

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Who wins

  1. Vasyl Lomachenko

    107 vote(s)
    64.8%
  2. Shakur Stevenson

    58 vote(s)
    35.2%
  1. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Conor Benn is a big welterweight who moved up to fight a MW at MW because they're the son of his father's greatest rival and due to their names and the history between their fathers it was an absolutely massive fight and payday unlike anything they could ever earn vs anyone else.

    147 would be Shakur's 3rd weight class had he turned pro at the same age as Loma not his 7th-9th and whilst Benn is obviously bigger than Shakur his entire claim to fame is beating shot hasbeens and a washed CEJ who I genuinely believed he would KO and Benn is fringe world level at best.

    I'm not disputing he's a lot bigger than Shakur but Shakur is already insisting on rehydration clauses in what would be his 3rd weight class had he turned pro the same age as Loma vs fringe world level guys at best when he's a top 5 P4P guy and supposedly one of the most skilled fighters in the game and as Shakur said himself he doesn't want to fight fighters who are much bigger than him just like your boy Crawford didn't and literally never did in his entire 42 fight career. Not even once.

    And if Shakur does fight them he is only willing to do so if he can cripple them at the negotiating table with rehydration clauses to ensure they can't rehydrate to their normal fighting weight and therefore will be much easier to beat. How brave of him

    Loma was routinely fighting much or way bigger and longer guys not only without rehydration clauses but he was doing so in their backyards with a full set of your corrupt as sin thieving home refs and judges or on the road in what for the umpteenth time would be his 7th to 9th weight class had he turned pro at the same age as them.

    None of your boys are doing that. Hence why you ducked answering my questions. You're right it is about what you've done but it's also what you haven't done and none of your boys are doing what he did routinely and never will in their entire careers. Come speak to me when they have done so or can summon the courage to even try to do it once

    A gimmick? We've been here before and it didn't end well for you and it won't do now either.

    If Haney turned pro at 135 at 17 y/o with 24 hour weigh ins. Teo turned pro at 19 at 135 with 24 hour weigh ins. Shakur turned pro at 126 at 19 with 24 hour weigh ins. What weight do you think Loma would've turned pro at at 17 y/o when he was campaigning at atomweight 105lbs with same day weigh ins? At flyweight 112lbs with same day weigh ins at 18-19 y/o?

    105
    108
    112
    115
    118
    122
    126
    130
    135

    You do the math, Einstein

    Why would a 105 pounder who was making that weight with same day weigh ins turn pro six divisions North or their actual fighting weight?

    Why would a 112 pounder who was making that weight with same day weigh ins turn pro 4 divisions North of that weight?

    Fighters generally turn pro South of the divisions they were fighting at in the amateurs, duh, because they aren't weighing in the same day of the fight and having to do so every day they fight in the tournaments

    And there's no maybe about it Loma would so obviously been way more than a three-weight champ had he turned pro in his teens like those guys did. He's never lost to a smaller fighter in his life and he literally only has one loss to a fighter his size in his life and he avenged it x 2.

    In over 420 fights am and pro combined he has 4 losses and it should only be 2 because of your corrupt thieving refs and judges and all three of his pro 'losses' were against fighters who were way bigger than him. Salido 11lbs. Haney 20lbs and Teo easily as much as Salido.

    How many times Shakur been outweighed by 11lbs? Crawford? I'll wait but you will duck answering because you know it's literally never happened once even though they've fought or campaigned in 4-6 divisions. Bloody weight bully bums move up 3-5 divisions and they still aren't fighting bigger guys or significantly bigger guys.

    147 and 154 would be Shakur's 5th and 6th divisions and that's with him turning pro in his teens. He's already demanding rehydration clauses in what would be his 3rd one vs domestic/fringe world level guys for goodness sake

    And, again, why is he ducking Haney and demanding rehydration clauses when he's way bigger than Loma, in his prime, the fight would be in his country with home refs and judges were he will receive a fair shake when the tiny Loma fought a 20lbs heavier 6'' longer reach Haney in his backyard with a home ref and three home judges and a 36 hour weigh in when he was old and past his prime in what 100% would be his 9th weight class had he turned pro at the same age as Haney?
     
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  2. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    If Shakur is so good how comes he has much more losses on his CV as an amateur in way less fights than Loma?

    How comes he only sports a KO 44% despite the fact he has only fought 4 world champs in 25 fights and has been huge, very big or good sized and never undersized for every division he's fought in and has been fighting opponents he's way bigger than, bigger than or roughly his size and never much bigger than him and has only scored 1 KD vs a world champion, vs the way smaller Valdez?

    He has only dropped 2 opponents at 135 and above, a Japanese fisherman and an electrician. In fact, he has only scored 3 stoppages in his last 11 fights and only dropped 4 of his opponents in them which encompasses all bar 1 of his fights at 130 and above and he was either much bigger than them, bigger or at worst roughly the same size

    Loma has a KO 66% and has fought 13 world champs in 21 fights and he has either KO'd, dropped or hurt everyone he's fought at 135 sans Teo despite them all being much or way bigger and heavier than him and often having huge reach advantages over him

    He has knocked out or stopped 7 world champions and scored KDs vs 7 world champs and 3 of the fighters who took him the distance at 135 only survived being stopped by the skin of their teeth after he dropped them despite them both being huge and way bigger than him.

    Pedraza was dropped x 2 in round 11 and extremely fortunate to make it out of the round

    Campbell literally had to rugby tackle Loma to the canvas to buy time for his head to clear after being hurt and the bell came to his rescue after being dropped and badly hurt

    And Loma dropped Commey like a sack of potatoes and then stood off gesturing to his corner to pull their man out which allowed Commey to recover

    Shakur's not been doing that to world champs and top contender way smaller than him, smaller than him or his size, let alone ones way bigger than him

    How comes it took him 9 rounds to get a domestic level electrician out of there who literally had no camp, took the fight on four days notice and was making a huge leap up in class? Loma would've sparked that electrician out cold in 2 or 3 rounds if they had a decade's notice and 15 week camp despite being a lot smaller than them and everyone knows it

    Guess what, Einstein? Kambosos beat Teo too, ergo.. Kambosos>> Loma, right?

    Oh wait.. Loma literally KO'd Kambosos in his backyard when old and well past his best. Shakur wouldn't even drop Kambosos, let alone stop him despite being way bigger than Loma and in his prime


    Your logic
     
  3. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond Ridin' the rails... Full Member

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    Loma would present some very troubling stylistic issues for Stevenson imo but the size difference would come into play. Loma's win over bigger guys like Campbell is very impressive but they weren't in the same class talent wise, whereas Stevenson clearly is. This would lead to physicality being the key difference and I don't see Loma over coming it imo. We all say how much trouble had with the bigger Haney. Devin isn't in the same class talent or skills wise as Shakur.
     
  4. Xplosive

    Xplosive Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    The uncomfortable truth for the majority of this forum is that Stevenson would have outclassed Loma. He's just better, and that fact will make the many of the Eastside Loma fanboys gasp because they hold Loma on a mythical pedestal that's rooted more on his highlights than on his resume of wins.

    Lomachenko was more flash than substance. There is nothing rooted in actual in-ring accomplishments that suggests Loma would have beaten Stevenson.

    Shakur would have soundly outboxed Loma. I expect a lot of cope in response to this post, but it is the truth.
     
  5. Xplosive

    Xplosive Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I agree with you Rough, but at some point the whole size thing feels like a crutch that Loma fans like to use.

    He never looked too small when destroying the Crolla's and Kambozos's of the world.

    Shakur is better than Loma. THAT would be the big difference.
     
  6. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond Ridin' the rails... Full Member

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    Yeah, I agree with you mate. Guys like Crolla and Campbell are one thing but Shakur is on the same level as class and actually does some things better imo. I don't think Loma's offensive skills would be enough here to offset that alongside the size factor.
     
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  7. Ted Spoon

    Ted Spoon Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Putting size disparities/injuries to one side for the moment, Loma didn't have the best sense of where he was in a fight. The painfully slow start against Lopez. Taking the last round off against Haney. He left things open for debate, which Usyk didn't.

    Stevenson made the key point when he said Loma was better at the lower weights. Was a bit like Roman Gonzalez at 115. Not as potent.
     
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  8. Rollin

    Rollin Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Mandatory Lomachenko rewatch for some of y'all.
     
  9. makzy

    makzy Member Full Member

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    Shakur dominates him, he's just better.
     
  10. Xplosive

    Xplosive Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I'm blown away by his ability to dominate HOFmers like Gary Russell, Nicholas Walters, and Roman Martinez...

    I'm also awed by his ability to beat up a Rigo who spent his entire career at 122...

    I think YOU need to re-watch Loma getting outclassed by the very man Shakur made look like a novice last night.

    It's the most uncomfortable truth on Eastside, because he's one of the biggest darlings this forum has ever had. And the uncomfortable truth is that Loma was nowhere near as good as fans so badly want to believe.
     
  11. makzy

    makzy Member Full Member

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    Amateur boxing is very different from professional boxing. Before the relatively recent changes to headgear and the scoring system, it was even more so. Combination punching, even if not particularly effective, was incentivised heavily in the old scoring system, and given fights are only 3 rounds long, amateurs could (and still do) get away with taking so much more risk than the pros.

    A lot of amateur standouts end up being disappointing in the pros. Some recent examples include Robeisy Ramirez, Andy Cruz, Michael Conlan, Tony Yoka... The list goes on. Obviously, Lomachenko did not flop as hard as some of these guys, but given his incredible amateur record, his professional career ended up being quite disappointing to me.
     
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  12. Lonsdale81

    Lonsdale81 Active Member Full Member

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    Some of these fellas walk around at close to 170lbs.. Chenko is just small.. in the landscape of pre day weigh ins he was at a disadvantage against LWs.. because the trend these days seemingly (around those divisions) is to fight 20lbs below your walk around weight.

    He should have stuck to SFW IMO.. even though i think he did a number on Haney (whos a huge LW) i think the Lopez fight hurt him.. I know he probably wasn't 100% but he should have pulled out of that fight. He made poor career choices Loma.. & as super talented as he was they did hurt his Legacy.

    His beautiful foot work didn't win fights unfortunately and he took his foot off the gas a lot too.. even right from the get go I always thought if there's one criticism its that his output could have been better.
     
  13. Joeywill

    Joeywill Boxing Addict Full Member

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    147 would be Shakurs 5th weight class
     
  14. Joeywill

    Joeywill Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Why does Marlon Starling have more amateur losses than Mark Breeland?

    Like who cares
     
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  15. Lonsdale81

    Lonsdale81 Active Member Full Member

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    BS. Stevenson isn't going UP weights.. hes a SNAC product grifting the **** out of the weigh in process.. there's been reports he's been as high as 175 pounds in between camps.. in fact theres videos of him looking fleshy & IMO definitely close to that.. save that multi division crap for other gullible fanboys, Stevenson ain't no LW just like Crawford never was.