Evander Holyfield And Joe Frazier..

I think Frazier would find that out.

 

If Quarry and Bonavena could back up Frazier even if it was just for short time imagine what Holyfield would do. Holyfield bigger and faster then those guys could also match Joes conditioning an advantage Frazier usually enjoyed.

 

Holyfield had a left hook like Frazier (may he RIP) and a whole lot more. Why do people not see that?

 

They fall prey to nostalgic feelings.

 

Despite their stylistic differences and having different physical attributes, to me Holyfield and Joe Frazier are the same guy mentally. Hard, hard men who are indomitable mentally. Neither backs away nor backs down from anything.

At this level in a matchup that’s pretty even physically and mentally, it’s almost impossible for me to predict.

Ultimately I think Evander is more versatile and after 10-12 rounds of pure war that sees both of them leaving major pieces of themselves in the ring, I think Holy adjusts and jabs/boxes his way to sweep the later rounds f or a fair but close decision.

 

Tough call but all action, really. Frazier is coming forward and Holyfield is trying to sidestep for combinations.

 

Never mind that Frazier was still a bit green for the first Bonavena fight and handled him with much more ease in the rematch - you think Bonavena fought anything like Holy?

The post you responded to made the point that Cooper actually fought a lot like Frazier (was even coached by him) but was just not as good.

 

I’d pick Frazier in a war if it was a one off.
I could see Holyfield winning a rematch or one in a series,
Holyfield was tough as they come but I don’t see a KO either way and think Fraziers style, constantly bobbing and weaving would give Holyfield problems.
Holyfields ability to trade with bigger men doesn’t really help him with Frazier.
I don’t see why Holyfields strength would make the difference, Ali had supreme strength and Frazier did well against him even if he lost the series

 

Don't agree. Stamina and workrate is a must against Frazier if you can't just blast him out of there. Holy never had the power to do that.

Prime Holy has a much better chance of hanging with Frazier. FOTC Frazier had a completely different pace to '96 Tyson, or any Tyson for that matter. Don't think post heart issues Holy could live with that pace. Certainly not over 15.

 

No, because Holyfield did almost everything better. Do you think Bonavena would be ranked in the 90s ? I have my doubts Bonavena could beat Alex Stewart, he'd be a fringe contender at best, he was very crude

Holyfield has a far more stacked resume than Fraizer too. People say Holyfield struggled with guys like Qawi and Cooper, but he handled and stopped Cooper apart from that 1 off round and Qawi has better defense than Frazier so i take that into account.

Has Frazier fought anyone as skilled as Holyfield and someone as good of an inside fighter ? He has just as many questions as Holyfield. 70s Ali is not more skilled than Holyfield and is nowhere near as good in the pocket. I think Joe and Evander would have a trilogy with Holyfield winning 2-1 simply because he's stronger and multifaceted in comparison. Holyfield wrecked Mike Tyson

 

Who on earth questions that Holy was better than Bonavena? It was just almost as poor a comparison in terms of styles as possible can be made, when in fact Cooper not only had a similar style to Frazier but pretty much copied his style and had him as a trainer.

That was my point.

Then you go on about that Frazier never faced anyone as complete as Holy, when I never said he did. So exactly who are you arguing against there?

Instead of just admitting that Bonavena was a poor comparison you pull a strawman.

I would agree that Holy was more complete than anyone Frazier fought and have never claimed anything else. In fact, Holy was one of the most complete HWs there's ever been. Could fight any which way, but was probably a bit too fond of brawling.

But he was not in any way close in style to Bonavena, which was my whole point. Poor comparison. Just own up to it.

 

It's not an irrelevant comparison. Holyfield does virtually everything better than Bonavena, so why can't i bring it up ? This is such a stupid take. There is not a thing Bonavena has over Holyfield besides power but based on opponents accounts Cooper likely hit harder than Fraizer as well. Joe has been hurt by non puncher about as much as Holyfield and didn't fight as many power punchers as Holyfield, so it's inaccurate to say Holyfield cant hurt or drop him, and it's pointless to say Fraizer is more durable. Holyfield beat way more hard hitting heavyweights

Are you arguing for Frazier here ? or are you arguing that comparing Bonavena to Holyfield is meaningless to support Holyfields case ? Because it's not. It can still expose the flaws Fraizer had. Meanwhile Holyfield despite his flaws didn't get dropped 3 times, and Holyfield knocked Cooper out.

 

Tyson would be on prison.

 

Your first mistake was assuming I was comparing their styles when in fact I was using it to point out that Fraizer can be hurt and have problems with mediocre opponents just like Holyfield did, even though Cooper is far closer to Frazier in terms of styles, but this doesn't make my point mute. Looking at the actual performance, Holyfield won every single round apart from the round he got dropped in. Qawi would have been a better example, but he's defensively better than Frazier by a significant margin.

Fraizer still had a competitive fight with the very crude flat footed Bonavena. But you're going to sit here and tell me that bringing up Bonavena is as poor of a comparison that can be made when in fact Holyfield is better in virtually every facet of boxing compared to Bonavena ? Tell me, are you opposed to the notion of Holyfield being a favorite over Fraizer ? Or were you just bored

 

Holyfield did not fight like Bonavena he was much better than Him. Taller faster more skill more powerful. Holyfield would beat up Frazier in a tough fight. Joe had heart and wouldn’t give up. I think he survives early knockdowns to last into late rounds where he would be stopped or lose a lopsided decision to Evander.