Wilder's Right Hand?

No timing no speed telephoned in

it s gone

 

I completely agree, who did Wilder knock out that anybody in the top 10/12 of the time couldnt ko! His "power" hasnt left him it's just proven to not be this mythical hand of God when he's faced better opposition.

 

People scoff at Wilder's losses to Parker and Zhang, saying Wilder was 39 years old and past it.............yet Ortiz was 39 when Wilder beat him in their 1st fight.
So Wilder beating 39 year olds is mighty and impressive but Wilder getting beat at 39 doesn't count??

D.E.I.

 

Massively overrated, absolutely.

But still meaningful? Yes.

 

it was never super fast... he's lost raw strength for sure. I also think it was overrated.

 

A bit of perspective is needed though. I don't understand why people act like "Ten title defences", for example, is automatically more impressive that "Five title defences"....It isn't, it's all about perspective.

Usyk has ONLY fought 5 HW opponents, and 3 of those were HW champions at the time he faced them. Deontay Wilder has NEVER fought and beaten a Former World Champion, let alone one who actually held the belt at the time they fought.

Daniel Dubois KOs all the opponents Wilder has fought, that's where you need to add perspective. Wilder doesn't have a single name on his resume that fits him of being a "World Champion", let's be honest and real. The most impressive name on his resume is another manufactured 'bogeyman', in Luiz Ortiz. A man who also doesn't have a single impressive win on his resume.

 

You make a good logical argument which means the fury cucks will not agree

 

To be fair, Zhang and Parker are good fighters and much higher calibre than 95% of his cv. Only Fury and Ortiz are better or equal, but he did knock out King Kong and put the gypsy king down multiple times. He just lost that aura and confidence post Fury, he got worn down and crushed in fight 3 after working himself into a hateful frenzy, he was never gonna be the same guy. Funniest thing is that Fury turned up as if he'd rolled out of bed lol, he had been more concerned with his ill child and jogged by the hospital a lot for that fight and never wanted it, that's why it went to court so was a bad version of Fury yet he still took him out. Power is the last thing to go they say but seemed like it was the first thing for Deontay. I still wouldn't recommend Joshua take that fight.

 

You need to add perspective again though....What is it about Wilder's opponents, or Luiz Ortiz's opponents, that you believe make them 'Bogeymen' of the division?

Luis Ortiz's best victories are Bryant Jennings, a middle aged Tony Thompson, Travis Kauffmann and Dave Allen....What gives him the title of 'Bogeyman' with those victories? Like Wilder, Ortiz was manufactured to make Wilder appear a legitimate Champion, when in reality, every single Top HW fighter has been competing in Europe since the Klitschko brothers dominated the division.

I see nothing on Ortiz's resume to suggest he's a top HW of this Era. Nothing in America has been relevant in the HW division for years now.

 

I don't think Ortiz was some mythical opponent, I just think he belongs in the small % that are actually more impressive opponents Wilder faced. Ortiz resume is weak as hell relative to his reputation I agree. There was the notion that he was an avoided fighter but if these avoided fighters are what they're built up as, they sooner or later do something to back that up when they start getting chance, like a Golovkin or Sergio Martinez rather than a Bakole or Ortiz. When Wilder faced an actual world class fighter in Fury who wasn't scared of him he got removed from the picture.

 

Wasn't Stivern WBC champ at the time Wilder beat him?

And if we use context, Dubios was a mandatory and got rematched as soon as he picked up a belt that Usyk vacated as a "gift". Not quite the same as dethroning AJ and Fury.

Fighting 50 opponents at heavyweight with a 96ish percentage knockout ratio is far more impressive than having only ever stopped two opponents at heavyweight in both Witherspoon and Dubios. At least in terms of measuring power.

Point is that Usyk simply hasn't fought enough heavyweights to get a broader sense of where his power sits. Wilder came much closer to knocking Fury out than Usyk did for example.

 

This is pathetic moving of the goal posts.

So, Wilder had meaningful wins against 39+ y/o opponent but Wilder's losses at 39+ y/o dont count.

Applying a double standard is the epitome of D.E.I. - well done

Again, which HW champs did Wilder beat? Since you're deadset on worshipping and inflating his manufactured run. Surely, in his 40 fights with his Top ATG opponents, he mustve savaged dozens. Which ones????

 

No. Stiverne wasn't a legit World Champion. You've managed to identify the point at which the WBC decided to keep the WBC belt locked down in the US though.

Like I keep trying to state, the problem is, the best HWs in the World haven't been in the US for a long time. The WBC belt was kept in the US, to try and boost the popularity of the Sport over there. We all know that nothing draws the large casual audience more than the HW division, so the WBC marketed Wilder in a way to try and boost the casual audience over there.

I'm surprised it has fooled someone like you though, a fan of the sport who is 'Hardcore' enough to sign up to an Online Forum. Anybody with a slight amount of boxing knowledge should be able to identify that Wilder is a manufactured belt holder. He managed to avoid ALL relevant names in the Division both during his rise and whilst a belt holder....Until his team mistakenly took on a Tyson Fury they believed was finished and unable to compete because of years of drug abuse and weight issues.

Again, a 96% knockout ratio is only relevant if you're knocking out decent opponents. I'd have a 100% knockout ratio if I fought 50 paraplegics. Context is everything. Again, I could easily see Daniel Dubois, for example, having the same record against the same standard of opponents. Likewise I could see the likes of Tyson, Lewis etc, all having the same record against those types of opponents....That's why context matters and this "Biggest punching HW" statement is a myth, there's no evidence to back it up.

I think the Tyson Fury fights exposed Wilder's power, so too the Zhang, Parker and Chisora fights to a lesser extent. Wilder hasn't "Lost" his power, he just never had this crazy generational power to begin with.