Was Frazier past his prime in Kingston?

My guess also. A rematch 2-3 later years, though... Would Ali perhaps be getting a bit complacent at this time, just when Frazier was peaking? Not a good combo.

 

Yes, Frazier was considered past it at the time.

"They told me you were washed Joe."
"They lied."

Or as the famous story said.

 

That was said two and a half years later, though.

Frazier was a 3-1 favourite against Foreman.

 

A 29yo with 160/110, I'm betting this is alcoholism combined with stress/anxiety of a trash talking bully of an opponent. Apparently at his worst later in life it got up to 250/130

 

Bit of a short prime for an ATG no?

 

Frazier was an undefeated 29 year old who did better against Foreman in their rematch. If you use age to excuse this loss we can use it to excuse any losses.

With Frazier the opponents he struggled with were better then the ones he didn't the whole way through. After going Foreman, Bugner, Ali he beat Quarry and Ellis who were the best opponents he beat before the FOTC. To diagnose someone as declining you look for them to struggle against those they'd have no problems with in their prime. Prime Frazier was still prime Frazier when fighting the opponents prime Frazier had fought.

Fraziers fights with Ali and Foreman took a toll on him but Frazier didn't retire because he was done at 32. In 1975 so far as belts there was the world title and the regional NABF held by Ali and Foreman. Who Frazier had a combined 4 losses against. He could beat Norton, Jimmy Young and Lyle and he wasn't getting a chance at either. If he couldn't beat or get chances to fight Ali and Foreman there was nothing to facilitate Fraziers career continuing at that time. Floyd Patterson kept fighting in that situation because he was chasing a record. Frazier wasn't.

 

You were supposed to quote my emoji so i could deliver my punchline.

I was going to ask if you thought you were going to find your keys in a Joe Frazier thread?????

 

Ah, misread the title.

He definitely partied a lot before Kingston.

 

I think Tom Sharkey was done at 29. Lloyd Honeyghan too.

 

Been there done that.

 

Yes, a bit past.

 

Sounds hereditary, assuming he wasn’t on PEDs.

 

At this point, I'd have better luck searching here than my house.

 

maybe visit a Jack SharKEY thread!