If Ray Mercer Had Being An Opponent For Marciano?

You prove my point even more. Weight matters.

 

I think I made it clear- Marciano is top 3 IMO and the 1956 version of RM has a great chance to beat Ali and Joe Frazier over 15 rounds

 

You attempted to make your point by asking why Usyk doesn't weigh 190lbs when he fights at HW.

My reply wasn't intended to address any wider point about additonal size being of benefit at HW (it clearly is under certain circumstances), but rather to literally ask you why Usyk would trim down to 190lbs to compete at HW, when he was 207-211lbs in the ring at CW.

Do keep up, Steveo.

 

Good then we agree those guys could not beat the modern guys without great improvement whatever the source steroids better training etc.

 

No. Your point is disproven by history and reality. Men like Holyfield, Toney, Byrd, Usyk, RJJ, have proven how easy it is to put on muscle. It’s easy. Talent is what wins. Men like Foreman and Holmes easily put on weight in this era and we’re beating the best of the 90s as old 70s relics. Weight is not a skill. Marciano would come in heavier and stronger and more explosive than he already was because it’s easy to do. Style and ability to make someone fight your fight is what great boxers do. He was built to take on bigger men.

 

Wasn't the 1956 version of Rudy retired? Wasn't that the same guy floored hard by a geriatric lightheavy? Could you imagine Frazier or Ali getting such lofty praise were they floored hard by Foster instead of treating his head as a basketball with the canvas being their court?

 

Us ‘Modernists’ are saying those old time guys are not beating the new top guys. The ‘Nostalgists’ are saying ie. Marciano or Dempsey could beat Holyfield or Mercer etc and we re saying it’s not happening. Then when we explain why half of you say no Marciano had some special gift that made him able to beat someone faster and better skilled who also outweighs him by 30lbs. The other half realize they can’t refute our arguments so instead they say well if Marciano or Dempsey was 30 or 40 lbs of muscle bigger then he could win and it’s easy he just has to take PEDs or lift weights or drink a concoction from a witch doctor and bingo he’s a super bulked stud and now he can win. We agree with you buddy it’s the 35 lbs of muscle that is the main obstacle we ve been telling you about all along.

 

If any fighter knew they had to fight 15-20 rounds of boxing would they come in heavier or lighter? That’s checkmate

 

You question the stamina of fighters like Ali Frazier Holmes Holyfield? That’s just silly.

 

Do you mean Bob Foster, who had the distinction of never beating a heavyweight? Foster was stopped by Doug Jones, Ernie Terrell, lost to Zora Foley, stopped by Frazier and Ali (he did hurt and tag Ali but got stopped)
Foster was a tall light heavyweight who Stopped old blown-up old middleweight Dick Tiger in one of his best wins. He was a solid 175lb champ but never beat a heavyweight.

On the other hand, Archie Moore holds the record for KOs with 132 in his career. He beat 6"3 top HVWT contender Nino Valdes 2X and stopped top HW contender Bob Baker as well as ko'd Burt Whitehurst (who went the distance with Liston 2X) as well as stopping ATG Harold Johnson who fought in both divisions, Archie also beat the tough Clarence Henry (who had wins over Turkey Thompson and Bob Baker as well as Jimmy Bivins and Satterfield) so Archie while LHVWT champ basically dominated the heavyweight Big men.

By the way Marciano got up quickly and proceeded to give Moore a horrific battering, body head arms neck and head. It was a brutal beatdown.

So even you Seamus (who are one of the worst RM negatives and I been posting alongside of you for 2 decades) are reaching with that comparison.

Anyway, we all have our opinions, and we have all been right and wrong like a broken clock that is correct 2X daily

we can agree to disagree

 

Yes, Marciano beat a geriatric light heavyweight after said geriatric light heavyweight put him on the canvas.

And again, Frazier and Marciano were never floored by light heavyweights.

We agree.

 

The only successful big guys in the eras of old were Jess Willard 6"6 and 260lbs who was ko'd by 6"1 190lb Jack Dempsey.

In the Joe Louis era 6"6 260 lb. Primo Carnera was ko'd by 6"1 190 lb. Joe Louis- Louis also ko'd 6"6 250 lb. Buddy Baer who actually had an 84-inch reach as well as 6"5 260lb Abe Simon.

It wasn't until Ali that we had a 6'2 205 lb. heavyweight champ and his biggest foe was 6"5 Ernie Terrell but his 1st loss was to the 5"11 205lb Joe Frazier

even among today's giants like Lennox -Wlad- Fury- Vitali- etc. they were not always beaten by giants in fact average size men

 

ok Henry Cooper weighed 10 lbs. more than 175lbs at 185 when he put Ali on his arse - Banks was 190 and Frazier was 205 ) when they dropped Ali

Moore was 188lbs when he got battered by the Rock -pretty much in range -

Frazier was dropped by Mike Bruce 199 and 205lb , 5"10 Oscar Bonavena 2X - pretty much in range.