Update on boxrec has Marciano’s tallest opponent at 6”5

It’s not even a matter of if he should have been the next challenger. Maybe Charles was the guy inspite of losing to Valdez before his shot at Rocky and Moore beat Valdez. However Valdez spent an extended time at #1 contender during Rocky’s rein or when not 1 at a high rank. Rocky fought others not ranked 1 but not Valdez. Al Weill was a shrewd manager he knew Valdez was a bad matchup for Rocky. Moore may have beaten him (in a very close fight with only ref Jimmy Braddock a guy with ties to the docks judging it’s a little weird situation maybe for a title eliminator) but style-wise he was more suited to Rocky.

 

Ezzard Charles was the #1 Ring rated contender for both fights. Valdes was actually #2. The first fight was on the 17th June, below are the ratings for May 20th and June 21st to cover both sides of the fight.


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Comments regarding ratings etc post fight -

"THE fight, instead of putting Charles out of the running
so far as a contender is concerned, strengthened his hold.
Though the general impression seems to be that Valdes and
Cockell should get a chance to see what they can do against
the Brockton Blockbuster, one cannot shove Ezz to the
sidelines after his showing. He still must be ranked the
Number One challenger. He has earned still another shot
at Rocky according to Jim Norris who figures that such
fight in September will outdraw any other he can arrange
and the public will agree with that."

 

Again and again and again...he was #1 for about eight months until Archie Moore beat him. When he beat Charles, Dan Bucceroni became #1, which is fair because Valdes was so far in the hole from his 4-fight losing streak. Charles quickly regained the #1 spot.

The idea of Valdes being long standing #1 come from Ring Magazine ratings, which are not real ratings.

As for Valdes being a bad match-up, a guy who lost four times to career LHWs was not a bad match-up for Rocky ****ing Marciano. That is mythical nonsense. IF ANYTHING, Weil was afraid of Archie Moore, who the press came to adore and believe in--several of us have printed the SI article still extant in which they call for Marciano to abandon the idea of fighitng Valdes or Cockell and fight Moore instead. Moore has already beaten Valdes once, and Weil might very well have hoped that Nino would get lucky in a rematch. No such luck.

All of this is pretty factual, and you can verify it yourself. The only part that is conjecture is that Weil was more afraid of Moore--that is conjecture that comes from the fact that the press wanted Archie. But no, there is no evidence that Weil gave a damn about the mediocre Cuban, and he was NOT #1 for any length of time. It simply isn't true.

 

Valdes went unbeaten in11 fights between July 53 when Moore had beat him until May2nd1955 when Moore again beat him in a close fight.

"Nino wasnt a draw?" oh okay ,you don't get a title shot because you aren't a draw!

"Nino Valdes, an 11-5 underdog, overwhelmed the listless Hurricane Jackson, who showed only one brief flash of the fiery newcomer who beat Rex Layne, Clarence Henry and Dan Bucceroni in his exciting rise from prelim boy to No. 5 contender. In the 1st round, the Cuban thumped at Jackson's body with both hands. Shifting to the head when Jackson came out for the 2nd, Valdes drove his man half through the ropes with a solid right. Although the timekeeper counted to four, referee Al Berl ruled no knockdown. Another right sent Jackson to the floor and he was up at '2'. Another flurry drove Jackson to his knees for the count of '1'. The 3rd knockdown that ended the bout was disputed by many in the crowd as a push, but referee Berl ruled knockdown and the fight was over at 2:35 of the 2nd." -Associated Press

Post fight comment

• "He had nothing. Everybody expect us to go to body, we go to head in 2nd round. I knock out Marciano in 4 rounds." -Nino Valdes

• "Valdes rates the next shot at Marciano after the rematch with Charles that we hope to run in September." -Harry Markson, managing director of the IBC
• 
  
• Who got the shot, huge draw Cockell !
• 18,000 were at the Cockell fight ,that's the lowest crowd for any Marciano title fight! Even non title opponent Harry Mathews drew over 31,000 through the turnstiles! How did Cockell do against Valdes? He didn't last for 9 minutes of fighting! Even just 4 days short of 35 and clearly past his best Valdes had enough left to beat Ring ranked Brian London.

 

Well put and the Rings ratings have always been important because it was viewed as free from politics. The various boxing authorities whether it was a state authority or one of the these corrupt associations like the WBA always had vested interests in who they were pushing.

 

Valdes did not lose his 2nd fight to Moore until May 2nd 1955, yet Marciano signed to defend against Cockell on Feb25th of that year!

 

To take an extreme outlier, Ewart Potgieter was 7' 2'', with a 94'' reach, and his heaviest fighting weight was 351lbs. He peaked around the time that the torch was passing from Marciano to Patterson.

 

I would say the Ring ratings in the 1950's held more gravitas than any other.

 

You haven't got a credible name and we both know it .Potgeiter was an agromelic freak who couldn't fight at all.

You are being absurd.

 

Nino lost 4 fights in a row in 1953 -one was to 5"10 180lb Harold Johnson - he also lost to Billy Gilliam-Bob Baker and Archie Moore - Nino had a good run in 1954 but many felt he lost to Archie McBride - then he lost to Archie Moore in an elimination fight in 1955 -Nino was also dominated by the 5"10 183 lb. Bob Satterfield in May of 1955 getting dropped for a nine count in the last round. Valdes also lost to 6" 190 lb. Eddie Machen 2X in 1956 - Archie Moore was always a more dangerous opponent and well deserving contender.

As far as size - big heavyweights were around but most eliminated by the skilled smaller men - I have seen picture of Marciano- Vingo and Vingo appeared much taller and I heard Vingo was 6"4 - the 2 biggest heavyweights that were successful where Jess Willard, Primo Carnera, Buddy Baer, Abe Simon , most about 6'5 -6"6 and 260 give or take and they both lost to 6"1 190lb fighters Joe Louis and Jack Dempsey.

 

I posted the timeline from18th July 53 until May 2nd55 Valdes went unbeaten.
You're referencing the 40's .
Which 6ft 5 in 240/250lbs heavyweights of any ability were around in Marciano's time
Okay Vingo was 6ft 4in. he was also 189 lbs for their fight and having his first ten rounder , because he had only just turned 20 , he was a string bean novice whose ring experience was 6, 4 rounders and 10, 6 rounders.

 

You think Charles would have fought Valdes again?

 

Turns out he's undefeated against guys that are 6'5"

 

Then lets take a look at the two men who beat Potgieter, or held him to a draw.

James Parker, Jeff Dyer and John Holman.

All 6' 3'' or more all over 200lbs.

My point is that there was an ecosystem of big heavyweights, but they weren't making it to the top.