Greater fighter: Thomas Hearns or Wladimir Klitschko

Context never alludes me.

Not ever.


These were non elite level fighters who he lost to, with no fights or wins against any ATG opponents.

Therefore, it’s clear to see that that’s the reason why he was able to dominate for so long.

 

Yes, absolutely.

So???


You rank Wlad higher because he was much more dominant.

But then if he fought much lesser competition, then surely that has to be taken into account.

 

(I include Loudon's post here^^ for context only)

So, Vitali doing his littler brother's 'revenge' work for him should raise Wlad's stock - is that what you're really saying?

By the way, asserting that Sanders "was relegated to fighting 4 times after that and they were all tomato cans" is not great shakes for two reasons.

1. Sanders was an unrated part-timer and borderline retiree before he fought Wlad.
2. He was actually not that good to begin with.

 

We will have to see. But at least for now it's not as far along as you think IMO.

But a lot of lists will have Wlad in the top 10 which has come a long way to what it used to be.

 

Incorrect. He had fought 9 soup can in the past 12 months. That was was common for guys coming up.
Fury beat Chisora when he was 14-0.

Chisora beat Pulev in the rematch. Dillian Whyte beat and battered Povetkin in the rematch.
Bellew beat Haye in the rematch and in the prematch.

 

This is 12 fights Dino in 12 months:

Jerry Halstead TKO2 on 12/6/97
Ladislav Husarik TKO3 on 12/13/97
Derrick Lampkins TKO1 on 12/20/97
Marcus McIntyre KO3 on 2/14/98
Everett Martin UD8 on 3/13/98
Cody Koch KO4 on 5/23/98
Najee Shaheed KO1 on 7/10/98
Carlos Monroe TKO6 on 8/6/98
Steve Pannell KO2 on 9/19/98
Eli Dixon KO3 on 10/3/98
Donnell Wingfield KO1 on 11/14/98
Ross Puritty TKO11 on 12/5/98 - Loss

 

One thing I find a bit curious about Hearns is that he doesn't get more criticism for not facing his contemporaries like McCallum, Nunn, Kalambay etc. For years he and McCallum were the two best junior middleweights yet they never fought whereas Wlad gets criticized for not fighting Vitali. So how is the McCallum situation different than the Vital situation?

 

Wlad was so dominant that he stunted other careers. He was the tree that grew so tall it shaded out light to its competition. Dude barely lost a round for a decade while fighting often. He nuked the division.

 

This is also true. If the Klitschkos had not been around we would all be talking about Povetkin and how he wrecked heavyweight.

 

First of all, nobody should ever criticise Vitali and Wlad for not having fought.

How on earth could they have fought?

Regarding Hearns, he wasn’t at JMW for years.

Also, Manny had them both at the Kronk at one point.

He didn’t really get to fight guys like Kalambay and Nunn in the 90’s, because he chased the money rematch fight with Leonard, which was at SMW, and he’d had the 2 damaging losses to Barkley.

So he didn’t stay at MW for a prolonged period.

Whilst Nunn was fighting guys like Toney at MW in the early 90’s, Tommy was up at LHW fighting Hill, where he was trying to make history.

So he didn’t actively avoid anyone. He just went on a different route.

You could only really criticise him, had he have been in that late 80’s-early 90’s mix at MW. But he wasn’t.

 

He dominated a mediocre division, and only due to the retirements of his brother.

If Vitali hadn’t have retired and he’d have stayed active, Wlad wouldn’t have been seen as the ‘Man’ of the division.

He’d already had 3 losses which were embarrassing defeats, even before Vitali’s first retirement.

 

He was undefeated for a decade while fighting at the top. Short of World Wars interrupting events, there are no lulls in the division that last that long. He was so good, so effective, that he caused the rest to look mediocre, despite their previous accomplishments.

 

He was undefeated during his brother’s retirement, at the top of a mediocre division.

He stayed professional.

Dedicated.

Given his weaknesses and his losses that we saw, it’s highly unlikely that he’d have dominated a stronger division for as long.

 

I don't know how far he stunted the career of others, but Wlad certainly carved the names of 'Corrie Sanders' and 'Lamon Brewster' into heavyweight history.

Perhaps his greatest contribution to a career was to that of Sam Peter, who had a minority of afflicted individuals convinced that he was the second coming of 'George Foreman'.

I should imagine Old Man Tony Thompson is exceedingly grateful for two entirely unwarranted cracks at the title, as well, along with former Cruiser, Jean Marc Mormeck, who was ready to take the Heavyweight division by storm, having reached the peak of his powers by age 39.

Looks to me like Wlad had a tendency to either boost careers or lend a helping hand to those aimlessly stumbling through the doors of The Last Chance Saloon.

However, Wlad most certainly had a good go at 'stunting' Alexander Povetkin's ability to walk upright again – I'll give him that!

 

Are people ignoring the fact that between Wlad's loss to Brewster and Fury there were ELEVEN YEARS of domination, far longer than Marciano's career, longer than Frazier's functional career, longer than Dempsey's active career, longer than Riddick Bowe's effective career.... And that whole time he barely lost a round against such hyper skilled opponents as Povetkin, Chagaev, Haye, Ibragimov, Byrd, Chambers... Real sized heavies in Peter, Williamson, Austin, Thompson, Peter. I'd take that lot over the guys a lot of HOF'ers faced.

GOAT!!!