My all-time Top 15 HWs' wins against The Ring's Top 10

True enough but Weaver was a nobody when he fought Holmes and then KO'd the highly regarded #2 in John Tate for the WBA title. He then KO'd Gerrie Coetzee, who was actually rated #3 behind just Holmes and Weaver. Weaver was legit at this point. He was undoubtedly the next best heavyweight and had given Holmes his toughest defense. Fair to say more would have tuned in than fights against Berbick or LeDoux.

But this just reinforces how strong Marciano's reign was as I'm sure you would agree. All meat and no potato basically.

Tyson's reign is easy to underrate as i am sure you worked out per your rating of him. Smith and Thomas were both #2 and he was locked into the Tucker unification with Tucker at #7. He included Spinks as what we will call next best and finished with Williams at #2. So basically he fought best available as soon as Spinks would have him. The numbers still crunch the same tho i guess. 3 x #2 and 1 x next best rolls Holmes top end but obviously he pales on longevity which boosts Holmes ahead.

This is going to be a GREAT thread.

 

A good observation. He certainly lost it.

 

It's also worth noting the inactivity was to do with his problems outside the ring aswell.

He'd been in a car crash where he slammed into a tree I believe ?

He broke his hand in a street fight vs Mitch Green i think ?

Not to mention all the troubles he has having with Robin Givens at the time.

Leaving Kevin Rooney and etc didn't help either.

All the troubles he was having was like a snowball effect and it led up to the disaster vs Douglas.

I think the 1st Bruno fight was the first sign of Tyson starting to show weaknesses in his game, he didn't quite look like the same fighter in that fight I believe.

 

As a Holmes fan the names that I think Holmes missed out on and that I'm a bit disappointed he didn't fight are the following.

Greg Page = He missed out on a shot vs Holmes the 1st time when he got upset by Berbick, but he regained and went on a nice little win streak over the likes of Tillis, Snipes, and become Holmes's mandatory. Holmes didn't fight Page and instead fought some very undeserving challengers in Frank, M.Frazier.

Now I did hear Holmes got paid more for the other fights so in a business sense it makes more sense I guess.

But for legacy ? I think Holmes does deserve a bit of criticism for that.

Pinklon Thomas = Undefeated for 7 years was ranked number 1 between 1984-1985. Surely he was deserving of a shot between those years.

Mike Weaver = Yeah Holmes already beat him but Holmes fought him when he was considered a bit of a soft touch at the time. Their 1st fight was a classic in which Holmes got pushed harder in that fight than in any other of his championship fights barring Witherspoon, Norton. Weaver was ranked as number 1 between 1980-1981 I think a rematch should've happened at some point.

Really what would've been nice was to have Cooney vs Weaver which was originally going to happen. Then you really would've got a deserving opponent for Holmes.

 

This was at least partly due to change in management, I believe. Cayton had planned to keep his busy schedule, but King wanted a less frequent one. And then of course the out of the ring stuff, like the car crash and the fight with Green.

 

My top 5 would be identical to that aswell based on the numbers so I guess the numbers do hold alot of weight.

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Holmes
4. Lewis
5. Marciano

After that it's more down to preference IMO.

For example Tyson had a more dominant reign than Holyfield and has slightly more title wins overall.

But Holyfield did beat Tyson in a H2H match up which is very significant.

Holyfield also probably has a slightly stronger list of names aswell.

So again that's all down to personal preference.

 

I don't think Marciano would make my top 5 so I rate him lower than more people than I thought.

 

I forget the ratings started in the 1920s.

 

That's pretty much my top 5 as well. I think Johnson might have a case, but harder to know with his era. Had he beaten prime Jeffries, he'd certainy been there.

 

Truly great list. Thanks!

Was suprised that Liston didn't have any wins over ranked opp before Harris. He did beat Williams, Valdes and one or two other that were around the rankings at that time, but maybe not then.

Wasn't Golota ranked when Tyson beat him? And wasn't Etienne or some other? One of those might have been an NC, though.

 

Solid list I have Wlad at 4, Rocky 5, Lewis 6,
And I like Frazier’s resume more than Foreman’s but the 2 H2h results bump George