Deontay Wilder Had an Absurd Level of Confidence in His Weapon

And sometimes the alphabet titlists aren't even in Ring rankings.

 

As others have said, clearly not. Its just wild how enthusiasts see mediocrity and hype/casual fans see ATG.

 

If the alphabet rankings are garbage that shouldn't matter even as a backup. It just feels inconsistent.

 

Well, the pattern is there. Every alphabet body has its policy and its biases, but when majority of them agree on the ranking of the fighter, then that at least tells us something. Okolie is ranked number 4 HW in the world by WBC, but isn't ranked by any other body, so we can assume it can be not that realistic. Hrgovic is ranked in the Top 10 of all sanctioning bodies, including Top 5 in one, so we can assume that calling him a consensus Top 10 guy isn't a stretch, especially looking at the independent rankings that confirm that situation.

 

I feel the consensus uses Ring's rankings. Unless one is desperate to up some inflates ABC org numbers. In the late 90s/early 2000s, the WBO was notorious for their terrible top ten rankings. Their belt wasn't very established then, and they would omit from their top ten other org belt holders.

 

Excluding the WBO back when their status was in flux? Or guys who won and lost the belt in the same year? Or special circumstances like Botha getting his belt taken for drugs?

I'm sure theres an exception to everything.

 

The Ring also appears to be falling into that trap lately when Turki brought it. Having Gassiev ranked 9 is truly puzzling to me, but that could also be an indication as to how terrible the heavyweight landscape is at the moment.

Using that consensus, between 2015 and 2023 Wilder was ranked in the top 3. That's a pretty damn impressive ranking to hold onto for so long.

So I get that Wilder has his flaws (particularly resume earlier on in his career), but some people go a bit far in discrediting him when he has had some amazing achievements in his career for someone who is supposed to be a one-trick pony, especially given how light he is for a modern day heavyweight. If he was as bad as people suggested, he would have lost sooner to anyone with moderate boxing ability.

 

Not disputing his own ranking. It's his string of title defenses that were ****-poor. No one with 40 fights and a title should have their manager say "They aren't ready" for bigger and better. And especially unifications.

 

Oh I agree he should have gone for Wlad, would have been a good fight. My gripe is people selectively using rankings and being overly harsh to Wilder when he, for a guy who was generally at a weight disadvantage and only really had a right hand to carry him, did pretty damn well.

He fell short when he did really start stepping up the competition, but still made a solid account of himself during the Fury trilogy and gave us some exciting fights. Even his last fight with Chisora he put it all in the ring as an underdog and somehow outboxed him. Beats what other heavyweights are doing in the twilights of their careers, and it's better late than never.

 

Except as a couple of others have stated, it isn't selective. Ring ranking is the one to go with. Has been for a long while now. You should know this by now.

Who cares about him being at a weight disadvantage. That's been a part of HW boxing for decades. I swear, it seems like a new thing people are doing. With Wilder and also Usyk. No one gave Chris Byrd extra credit for being so much smaller than a lot of his opponents? Did Roy Jones Jr get extra respect being outweighed by John Ruiz? Nope. On the opposite end, does Lewis deserve LESS credit for beating guys smaller? Or Vitali? or Wlad? None of that was ever a topic here. And I was here on the board when those fights happened. Posters today cry way to much about that.

Chisora is more spent then a 50yo penny. That close fight said more about where Wilder is at then how much Chisora has left in the tank.
If two journeymen put on an exciting fight, still nothing more than journeymen.

Wilder should have tried to make his mark in his prime.

 

Yet Wilder remained in the top three for almost a decade. That would seem to suggest they considered him good enough to stay there, even with his title defences.

A lot of people care about weight on this forum and outside of it, and it'd be disingenuous of you to suggest otherwise. Usyk gets credit as a "giant slayer" and being the small man at heavyweight. If we're being consistent, where's Wilders credit for spending his whole career at a weight disadvantage?

Nah I call bull on that one. Everyone expected even a shot Chisora to pull it off because "Wilder was finished/was never that good". It's only after Chisora got his ass beat that the excuses came out.

These days, I'd find those two (even if far past their best) to be more exciting than fighting youtubers, MMA fighters and kickboxers.

I do agree, however, that Wilder should have made more of an effort at unification in his prime. We missed some truly exciting match ups.

 

Like MANY have said. This is a weak HW era. As a belt holder making title defenses, he likely deserved that #3 spot. And AGAIN, his ranking wasn't so much the issue, but his opponents. Not going to go in circles with you on that.

No one really gave a damn until Wilder and Usyk fans drove that into every conversation.

I don't know about saying "Everyone". There's a thread to look at if you care that much. I don't.

You are right, but Youtubers, MMA fighters, and kickboxers. But that's a damn low bar to hobble over. And that's the sad state of boxing today. How to generate as much money in a sport that now runs more like a business.

Makes me glad I was watching boxing in the 80s to now. Seen just how much this sport has turned to crap and a sideshow.

 

Idk, even the lower weight classes had the whole "weight bully" threads pop up. It's clearly a factor (personally I think there should be same day weigh ins, and heavyweight is a free-for-all with no excuses). It was more the inconsistency I was pointing out on how some fans seem to care about it in one case, but not the other,

Fair enough.

I agree. In two days people will pay to watch Usyk have a unified title defence against Rico before going on holiday for another year. I'll watch the highlights, but I ain't paying for the card.

Before my time sadly. I envy you.

 

Why give him a lot of credit for barely beating a forty something who has zero good wins and double digit losses?

 

I See those as well. I don't know...are these guys whining about it new to boxing? These "weight bullies" have existed since the inception of prior day weigh ins. People have complained about it forever, but seems more vocal with this board the last few years.

The problem with same day weigh ins was guys draining themselves to make weight. The resulting "dry out" caused too many brain injuries. That's what started the day-before weigh ins. An attempt to mitigate those injuries. But as we saw, they brought up a whole new problem with guys gaining 15-20 pounds after the weigh in. We can say "Well, they should fight in their natural weight class." But that will never be the case. The boxers are always going to look for an advantage. But with weight bullies, their opponents are still offered the same strategy. It sucks, but there aren't any quick fixes for this issue.

Some ideas that have been floated around over years I've seen were:

1. Year round weight checks. Requiring a boxer to be within a determined percentage of his fighting weight over the course of the year. And that idea has it's flaws as well. Guys move up in weight, guys move down some (Obviously more rare). And guys fighting once/twice a year wouldn't want to be required to stay close to their fighting weight year round if they don't have a scheduled fight. Plus not all boxers make mega bucks. In fact, most don't. Some low level boxers have other jobs.

2. Rehydration limits. To me, this seems the more reasonable and doable. I think it's the IBF that has a rehydration limit for title fights. Could be mistaken. It wouldn't work with a limit on how many pounds, but with a percentage of the fighters weight, since with smaller guys and bigger guys,10 pounds can be a major difference.

But all ABCs would have to be on board for this to work.

Same. Not dropping a dime for this. In fact, as much as I enjoy watching Usyk fight, if this backfired, would be quite something.

It was quite amazing! Only two major belts, until the IBF became more recognized. Guys HAD to fight other contenders for a title shot. No picking and choosing which of the 5 belt holders to go after.

And then there was big fights on free TV. World Wide of Sports had fights on Saturdays. USA Networks Tuesday Night Fights. Thursday Night fights, and ESPN's Friday Night Fights. There were some real bangers on the shows!

I even miss Showbox on Showtime and Showtime Championship Boxing, HBO Friday Night Fights and Saturday's Championship boxing on cable. Guys like Lennox Lewis and Oscar DLH defending their titles on non-PPV shows was great. PPV fights used to be just for HUGE fights.

And best of all, guys who fought three times a year and NO F'N YOUTUBERS!!!

But hey, I enjoy discussing with you Kiwi. You make me think. Can't say that for a lot here