36yr old Ali lost to a 7 fight novice (Spinks), 39yr old Usyk beat kickboxing legend with 77 fights

Just stop. Ali was amazing and unlike the vast majority of fighters from across the pond he was a road warrior with an excellent chin. But this is what I mean about the boxing nostalgists and their double standards. They have a million excuses for their favs from previous eras and are extremely heavy with applying context when it comes to them but when it comes to the fighters of today and in particular certain fighters, type of fighters, or fighters from certain parts of the world it's the complete opposite and they act like these fighters are immune to the ageing process and still in the midst of their primes in their mid to late 30s even though all you have to do is go back and watch the footage of them in their primes or even a few years ago to see the glaring decline or glaring decline in certain areas

And they're completely incapable of being even remotely fair and won't even acknowledge or allow even the slightest bit of context to be applied when it comes to these fighters even when they're almost 40 y/o and routinely doing things at that age when long past their primes that no other current champion or elite fighter in the sport is doing even in their primes and very likely won't ever do either, let alone routinely

At 36 y/o Ali lost to a 6-0-1 20lb lighter Leon Spinks who'd beaten nobody and whose best result was a draw vs a club fighter/journeyman who is widely considered to be one of Larry Holmes worst defences and Holmes had lots of them

And in his fight prior to winning the HW world title and one of his greatest ever wins Ali was also saved from a KO defeat by the bell vs a 22lb lighter 185lb Bivol sized glass chinned/paper skinned Henry Cooper. If that happened to Usyk even now at 39 y/o he would be absolutely crucified for it on a molten cross by these exact same people

And it doesn't take anything away from what Ali achieved or his greatness just like this doesn't with Usyk when almost 40 freaking y/o


And FTR nothing like that has ever happened to Usyk or come remotely close to happening even though he's run a gauntlet of savage punchers and legit bangers not only his size but vs many way bigger than him and when past or way past his prime. Some of the shots he took of a 260lb shovel hands colossus Rico were massive and landed with a huge thud and the size difference was obscene.

It was actually insane he didn't go down because it looked a power punching 175 pounder cracking a 108 pounder with their best shots and you could see the shockwave travelling from his chin down to his feet simply due to the massive size disparity and natural size disparity. Rico was a ripped 258lb with low body fat, walks round at an in shape 275lbs, and Usyk is a natural CW who if in the kind of shape Rico was would weigh under 210lbs and should weigh no more than 220

 

Ali wasn't knocking anyone down at 39 y/o, let alone a 258lb colossus twice his size who walks around at a very much in shape 275lbs because he was very often the bigger or much bigger man and never fought anyone even remotely close to Rico's size or the size of these other giants Usyk has routinely been fighting in his mid to late 30s. The biggest guy he fought was Buster Mathis who was woefully out of shape and 6'3'' with a 76'' reach

In fact, Ali was 34 y/o the last time he knocked someone down that was when he was facing the much smaller glass-jawed Richard Dunn who Rico would ice out cold early

Ali was taken the distance or late by many low level fighters and he had 15 rounds to get them out of there not 12 like Usyk who's a terror in the championship rounds and would score a lot more stoppages if he had 15 rounds to get the job done

 

I keep repeating it because it's true. The only thing that prevented Ali from being knocked out was the bell ringing, I never said it was some conspiracy the bell rang or that the bell isn't part of the sport. Of course it is. Ali's lucky Cooper didn't land that shot a little earlier but he didn't and that's no one's fault it just is what it is

And lots of people believe it. Hence the decades of controversy

Sonny Liston was a much bigger, better and more powerful fighter than Cooper but he couldn't drop Ali six months later. No matter how you try and spin it Cooper dropped Ali like a sack of potatoes and Ali was badly hurt and it was plain to see he was badly hurt and I firmly believe through all my years following the sport and the countless fights I've watched Ali was going to get knocked out had the bell not come to his rescue

You just have a sense for these things just like I do that Rico was about to get KTFO had he not bee givin 29-30 seconds to recover. You're free to disagree but I trust my gut feeling more than I trust anything or anyone else and hand on heart my gut tells me strongly he was going to get knocked out

There are far too many fighters to name who've only been knocked out once or twice but have survived being dropped

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I'm not interested in all of this context and excuses because, duh, they're applied extremely selectively and they are never factored in from these same people when it comes to certain other fighters, certain types of fighters, or fighters from certain parts of the world or eras.

These same agenda-driven clowns are trying to have us believe that Usyk at almost 40 y/o and when clearly past his prime and a very sluggish career highest weight and having declined an awful lot to the prime version is still in his prime and any loss or poor performance he has at this age is representative of him in his prime and should be used as a scythe to tear his entire career, accomplishments, and legacy to shreds which again is a standard they hold no other fighter to, even when facing younger power punching giants who hold an obscene size advantage over him that not only are none of his fellow P4P greats and highly ranked P4P stars having to contend with but so many of the HW greats never did or many never even came close to because in complete contrast to Usyk they were giants or big or very big HWs for their eras

FFS, I'm not the one being unfair here

 

Huh? No I don't at all. I never said such a thing. I'm talking about one specific fight and what I observed in it and what I strongly sensed was that Ali was saved by the bell. That's my honest opinion and I'm well aware Ali recovered from a monster Frazier left hook but I think he was actually more hurt by Cooper's one and he looked groggy and still hurt as he was sitting his the corner, so much Dundee felt the need to administer smelling salts to him to revive him which I believe was actually prohibited in Britain at the time

I don't keep ignoring it it's not even remotely comparable situation. Usyk ever so briefly voluntarily took a knee after shipping a body shot, wasn't badly hurt at all, and jumped right back up and was in no danger whatsoever of being stopped, and he didn't have a 22lb weight advantage over Beterbiev either.

It's not even like it was body shot which sucked all the wind out of him and had him writhing on the canvas in agony unable to get his breath back. It was basically body shot flash KD whereas Ali was dropped like a sack of potatoes and was badly hurt and in danger of getting stopped.

And Beterbiev's a far better fighter than Cooper was.

 

Nah, the boxing nostalgists are the worst. The recency bias brigade (and FTR I'm far from one) who believe that all fighters from the past are inferior because the sport evolves are annoying but they're fewer in number and not nearly as insufferable and up their own asses or unfair.

I'd rather never post on any forum again than post on the Classic for a single day and I say that as someone who was an avid reader of boxing magazines for many years and some of my favourite boxing related memories of all are reading about the greats from the 1900s-1970s, especially from the first half of the century, and I absolutely loved reading the posts of Classic poster legends like John Garfield who wasn't in the least bit haughty.