Sonny Liston Vs. all previous HW champions; Mount Rushmore (H2H)

Louis beats him
Cant see him losing to any of the others

 

I think Louis' chances are at least 50/50, but it’s pretty open for me.

When it comes to Dempsey, he could be stylistically tricky for Liston with his explosive power, hand speed, timing, and reflexes. Still, I think Sonny fought in a more developed era.

This exact topic was actually my very first post here on the forum:
https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/sonny-liston-prime-vs-predecessors-prime.661349/

 

Walcott, Charles, Tunney, Sharkey and especially Louis can all beat him. I'd bet Liston loses a few of them and always to Louis.

 

I meant to vote for Gene Tunney. By mistake hit Jack Dempsey.

 

Liston is so overrated it's crazy

The idea that Ali was the first heavyweight who would've beaten him is farfetched

 

Always losing to Louis is tough cause he has the length and the chin advantage.. probably more power but I think Sonny Liston is a counter punchers dream

 

I don't think Liston has a chin or power advantage. As far as I can see he's just a slower Louis with longer arms.

 

Surprised you'd say the chin

Didn't Joe Louis get dropped a lot ?

Surprised you'd disagree on chin advantage being that Joe Louis got dropped

 

I tend to think Liston is overrated too Same as Joey will. I think Marciano beats him. IDK about the earlier Heavyweight's I would tend to say no. I have liston inside the top 20 but not top 12.
Here is an article I wrote awhile back on Marciano & Liston. I left out a section.

Thoughts on Sonny Liston vs Marciano and modern heavyweight advancement.

Pretty big talent gap between Cleveland Williams/Floyd Patterson to a Rocky Marciano. Nothing indicates Liston was capable of such a large talent leap forward based on his only level up against Ali going dreadful. The guy completely wilting in the face of adversity. Assuming Liston isn’t going to get majorly discouraged when thing’s don’t go his way round after round is a big assumption. Cleveland Williams? Ernie Terrell beat him it’s the grand canyon going from that to Marciano. . Liston would wilt like a flower against someone will real talent I do believe I always have.

Heart really matters in boxing it has a long history, it’s what Got Denver Smith a victory over Joe Goddard as a big underdog & countless others throughout history. While we are dealing with some option, some fact does exist and Liston in the large moment’s appeared to get disheartened at rate not found in most pure champion’s. That much isn’t speculation. What he did against Machen or Cleveland williams matters much less than a largely attended superfight with real mental pressure.

The Data against Floyd Patterson proved far too short of rounds to draw such large comparisons as outclassing a fighter with much better skill than Patterson. In no way shape or form does Liston project as a talented fighter such as a top modern heavyweight. They are far larger & far more skilled than Machen or Cleveland Williams. He would always have a puncher’s chance but his skill just doesn’t translate against a more modern Ali. He had trouble with movement it was demonstrated over & over again. Holmes would have his face carved up. Again not fact but his footwork was meandering at best. He was outdated by the mid 60’s it was proven. Even a C level fighter like Leotis Martin got a jab going and he succumbed. Regardless how you wanna paint his age as an excuse it’s the same script that Ali had Jab & move and it was a problem for him once again, same as before.

Marciano has the will/heart of a top level champion. Liston does not he's a dinosaur in land of modern fighters. While this is an option I do feel it to be accurate. I Meet many people who shared my thought that Liston should be ranked around 15th to 20th best heavyweight ever. While Liston would tower over Marciano. It's no different than a Kid Carter a lightheavy facing a true heavyweight in Gus Ruhlin. Mick Dooley facing Joe Goddard. History is filled with an extreme talent overcoming a slow moving target with power. The Premium top end talent is already assuming a few knockdown will occur to them but just like Dooley and Kid Carter all that meant was them getting through the round.

The top guy's always had the ability to turn a defeat into a win and snatch victory from the jaws of defeat. They all had it and Marciano definitely unquestionably had it. The mistake everyone makes in this matchup is just assuming Liston would keep Marciano down. Once he got up and I can almost guarantee the killer instinct confidence of Liston would be shaken dramatically when Rocky sticks punches in his face coming forward. Every Reach disadvantage in history was overcome by smaller men from time to time. Reach matters much less when thing's turn to a brawl at close quarters and Marciano just like Kid Carter had the power to really cause damage with short quick compact punches. Carter never need much space at all and I know neither did Marciano would had even more power than Carter.

I would guess Marciano TKO Win 13. At that point Liston would be gassed and heavily discouraged. It's my 2 cents worth. There certainly remains a chance Liston could secure a cuts win. But Talent wise Marciano is way ahead in skill and he has enough power at close quarters to change any tide in the fight to swing his way.


With all that said Liston would be far ahead of less modern fighter's like Johnson & schmeling & Tunney...

Marciano & Louis were just far more Advanced than those before them.

 

Yeah he got dropped a lot but he never got KOed in the first round by a light punching guy like Liston did.

 

He obviously quit vs Ali

That wasnt a reflection of his chin imo

 

I don't see any world where you get dropped in the first round and that's where the fight ends isn't a reflection of a chin.

 

The punch hit him in a blind spot.. More of a flash knockdown

Not getting up is more of a lack of heart imo

 

I'll prolly respond to this later, but I'm genuinely surprised people here think Marciano could beat Liston.