Is Usyk a Top 10 Heavyweight of all time?

1990s considered to arguably be the strongest heavyweight division and the number one guy was not American (Lewis)

 

Then we agree. I am saying few have ever done it. Usyk cleared this division, I don’t see too many top guys for him to fight. Only a few other heavyweights in history can say they have done it. Makes him a top 10 guy for sure, probably even a top 5.

 

1) I don't think Usyk cleared his division.

2) I accidentally read your post as "Probably not, too many heavyweights have actually cleared out their division in their times there." instead of "Probably, not too many heavyweights have actually cleared out their division in their times there." because I'm tired. That is my mistake.

 

Who do you want Usyk to fight and you would consider he cleared the division?

 

Clearing a division to me isn't just beating a few top guys. It is absolutely removing anyone remotely an option for a contender. It is when you start at the top and keep digging downwards and you hit rock bottom and there's nothing left to do. It's Alexander the Great weeping because there's no more worlds to conquer. It's Canto at flyweight, it's Saldivar at featherweight, it's Louis at heavyweight, etc.

Usyk has 9 fights at heavyweight in total with 3 of them being repeat opponents. That is simply not enough to have cleared out a division.

I'm looking at the current ring mag top 10 and unless I'm looking at the wrong list, Usyk has only beat 2 of the top 10 on the list I'm looking at. That's not clearing a division. I'm looking at the 1960s year end lists for featherweight and Saldivar beat most of these guys sometimes he has 2 or even 3 wins on them. If you were to make a top 15 of heavyweights of Usyk's era, how many did he beat? 3? 4? Now compare that to if you were to make a top 15 of the featherweights in Saldivar's era. Winstone, Ramos, Laguna, Robertson, Seki, Famechon, Legra. That's 7, maybe that number would be slightly higher or lower if I went about making a real list but the difference is pretty clear. Saldivar cleared an era, Usyk had a brief stint at heavyweight where he got some top wins. I'm not saying it isn't impressive, I'm just saying it's not clearing a division

 

"If it was a 16 man tournament of the best in history and i pulled a Peak Oleksandr Usyk as my fighter"

Funny you say this. I had this EXACT same train of thought just yesterday as well but expanded it to Top 32 H2H heavyweights of all time.

If you were to have a simulation run the tournament a gazillion times, with everyone in their prime I think Ali and Usyk would come out with the highest win percentage.

 

I think you could argue he's top ten. Very short resume but packed with good names. Would having 20 more journeymen really increase the value of this resume by that much?

 

90% of the other top champions/contenders were American.

 

I consider his ENTIRE career because many HWs of the past were CWs. He's there or thereabouts yes.. low end..

 

No.

 

I think Usyk's ranking in an all time heavyweight ranking is open to different interpretations, given that he fought most of his career at cruiserweight. He's obviously also done very well at heavyweight, where I place him in the top 15 all time. But I think Usyk's value deserves a place in the all time p4p rankings, where I think he's in the top 25.

 

American media doesn't care about anything below Welterweight. Roman Gonzalez in his prime was literally on undercards.

 

i guess it all depends on how we define what an all time great is.
but for me, i'm leaning at yes.
he beat everyone that he was matched up with,
he's at the end of his career now he can cash in a fight or two then stroll to retirement.

 

no.....................phenomenal, HOF'er, ATG....................he's not in the top 10 of HW's

Top 3 CW though IMO

 

Which heavyweight boxers still fighting at 39yrs of age, would you put into the the top 10 heavyweights of all time?