Anecdotes ongoing

I did call Joe Jr. at a later time to confirm my understanding of Joe Sr's height. I was getting a lot of condescending guff from Frank Lotierzo, who until then I had much admired for is very erudite writings on the sport. Alas, countering his notion that Frazier's listing of 5.11.5 was as ludicrous as Tyson doing so lent to his dissing me like I was his ADD teen stepson. Lotierzo insisted that at a banquet he and they attended Joe "towered over Tyson." So I celled Joe Jr. (always relaxed and receptive) and he said "Dad was at most 5'10 like me." He knew Lotierzo (both live in Philly) so I asked Joe Jr. for permission to give Lotierzo his cell to ask the same question and he said sure. I mailed Lotierzo the # and true to form never heard a further peep.

Foreman (and you can find this) said "Joe never saw 5'10." My dogs could look at a pic of Ali and Joe center ring for instructions and ascertain a 5 inch dif (and remember Ali went on record saying he was in fact just 6.2.5" ).

Best of all (for me at least) I actually ran a mile one winter night with Joe. I was in school in Boston and his band stopped there as part of a tour. I read in the Boston Globe sports where the gig was and it said he was doing roadwork afterward with a comeback against Kallie Knoetze in the works (so late winter of '78). I went and staked it out just before 2AM and sure enough soon Joe comes along in a gray sweat suit and converse (no head covering or neck towel) with a Caddy taking up the rear. I waved my hands and eased toward him and said I was a long-time fan and current Golden Glover sparring partner / college student and could I run with him. Without the slightest alarm he gave me a quick glance up and down and said "Sure, why not" and we did a mile (the Caddy didn't react by zooming up to check on me which speaks to that different time). To ingratiate I said I was hopeful Marvis would make the '80 Olys (thanks Jimmy Carter!) and he smiled hugely and said "I hope so, too." At run's end we paused face to face and he cracked a smile and offered to have me driven back to the staring point but I said thanks no bother I want to jog back and think about what a special experience he just gave me. Specific to this thread, we stood face to face to shake hands and I was an even 6'0 at the time and struck by how much shorter he was and being barely a lightheavy thought of Foster towering over him center ring. I went back to my crib and said to my roommate (a fighter-student) "Damn! Joe must be 5'9!"

As to Tyson, beyond further common sense looking at him center ring with whomever, I once drove Randy Neumann to Atlantic City when he was going to ref Nigel Benn v. Doug DeWitt. Back in the division's greatest era Randy cracked the top 10 (and summarily took a whipping from Quarry). I had written Randy after his piece on attending neurology clinic for refs appeared in the NY Times (1990ish). I was doing a pediatric neuro fellowship in Jersey at the time and Randy called and invited me to accompany him. He had an older Mercedes and wanted me to drive. Among a thousand other boxing topics during the trip I wondered about Tyson's height and with no hesitation he said "5'9 for a fact."

In closing, the one ATG whose height I wish I could have determined if not by standing face-to-face then at least by such an esteemed source was Qawi. Fair to say that the question of his height lingers more so than any other ATG (agreed?) and probably because it was more off-the-grid for his divisions and MUCH taller ATG opponents than anyone else in the history of the sport (but for the color barrier and Johnson ducking him for a title shot Sam Langford would probably be right up there with him on the ?). So I can sleep at night I long ago decided Dwight was not as short as 5'5 or tall as 5'7.5 but probably 5.6+ish.

 

Thanks and it didn't let me edit the typo "...back to the staring point." Almost impossible to avoid a typo in a long post with no edit program