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Performance, Fighter and p4p Year End List

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by blood_lust, Dec 8, 2008.

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viperguy Well-Known Member Full Member

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OK Hopkins, it's too obvious this is you because how can you lose a fight and still be nunber 1 P4P LOL:rofl:rofl:rofl.

blood_lust said: ↑

As 2008 winds down there have been some great performances by underdogs and favorites alike. Manny ended the year on a high note with his beat down of DLH. However, that wasn't even the most impressive performance of the year in my opinion. Here are my top performances, fighter of the year ratings and final p4p of 2008.

Performance of the Year

1. Hopkins UD12 Pavlik - What else can you say but a good old fashion ass-whooping'. Hopkins, at 43 years old, was able to dominate a prime and UNDEFEATED Pavlik, and landed the elusive bolo punch!!! I can't imagine any other fighter from any era being able to do what he did to Pavlik at 43 years old. On top of this Pavlik was top-10 p4p fighter and Hopkins was the underdog as well.

2. Margarito KO11 Cotto - Margarito absolutely took over Cotto after the 7th and destroyed a prime and UNDEFEATED Cotto who was ranked in the top-5 p4p at the time. Margarito was the underdog too.

3. Darchinyan KO9 Mijares - Darchinyan moved up in weight and absolutely dominated and stopped a prime and top-10 p4p champion in Mijares. A brilliant performance.

4. Caballero TKO4 Molitor - Caballero went to Molitor's backyard and destroyed (quite possibly ruined too) Molitor in a short and brutal one-sided fight. Molitor was in his prime, an undefeated champion and had star potential written all over him. The result was a shock to everyone.

5. Pacquiao TKO9 De La Hoya - Manny moved up 12 pounds in weight to beat a past prime DLH worse than anyone not named Hopkins. It was an annihilation of the Golden boy and Manny was the underdog to boot. The only real negatives were as Freddie Roach himself put it, DLH "had no legs, was hesitant, he was shot" and DLH wouldn't be ranked in the top-5 at WW. DLH couldn't pull the trigger, but that's not Manny's fault and he looked AWESOME in stopping DLH!

6. Haye TKO2 Maccarinelli - Haye absolutely destroyed the #1 CW in brutal and quick fashion. A spectacular KO over a top CW champ.

7. Vitali Klitschko RTD9 Peter - Vitali comes back after 4 years of retirement to completely dominate the most feared puncher at HW and a top 3 HW at the time.

8. Marquez TKO11 Casamayor - Marquez came through in a competitive fight against one of the rings greats in Casamayor and became the first to stop him. Though Casamayor was past his prime, he was still recognized as the linear champ, a real threat coming off a great victory over Katsidis and Marquez moved up in weight to beat the "man" at 135.

9. Dawson UD12 Tarver - Dawson dominated former LHV champ Tarver who was coming off a quality victory over Clinton Woods. Though not the same fighter that destroyed Roy Jones Jr., he still was a dangerous fighter.

10. Calzaghe UD12 RJJ - Except for a flash knockdown, he dominated RJJ from round 2 - 12. He Roy Jones Jr'd the real RJJ. At first glance, many would rate this higher on the list, but as most know, RJJ was wayyyyyyy past his prime, but still a great victory, though not as dominant a victory as either Tarver's or Glen Johnson's, both of which were over a younger RJJ.

Those are my top-10 and I'm sure I missed a couple of performances. I left out the performances by Vasquez and others as they were great fights and performances, the ones I mentioned were all one-sided or very close to one sided with dramatic endings. Additionally, I'm sure many will flame me for placing Pacman's victory over DLH at #5, I place much more value on dominating a prime fighter versus a dominating a long and tooth fighter, regardless of the perceived weight advantages/disadvantages.

Fighter of the year

As for my fighters of the year. The top-4 are interchangeable in my mind and you can make a case for any of them being #1:

1. Margarito - Two dominating KO performances over prime and hungry top-5 WW belt holders in Cintron and Cotto, with Cotto being in the top-5 p4p at the time.

2. Hopkins - A dominating performance over Pavlik who was in his prime and in the p4p to-10 at the time and a very controversial SD loss (I had him winning as did most of press row) against a younger and fresher Calzaghe, who is arguably the greatest SMW of all-time and was ranked in the top-3 p4p at the the time. Two fights against two top-10 p4p fighters all at the age of 43 years old!

3. Darchinyan - Dominated and stopped two champs in Kirilov and Mijares who were both in their prime and top-3 in the division, with Mijares being a top-10 p4p ranked fighter at the time. Utter domination and KO'd both guys. You can't ask for more.

4. Pacquiao - A very close and controversial win over Marquez ( I had Marquez winning as did most of press row) who was top-5 p4p fighter at the time, a dominating KO against a top-5 belt holder at 135 in Diaz and a beat down of a long-in-tooth De La Hoya in a fight he moved up 12 pounds in. Great year for Manny.

5. Calzaghe - Very close and controversial win over Hopkins, who was top-5 p4p at the time and a dominating victory over a shot RJJ. Great year, but not as good as the four mentioned above.

Like I said before and of these guys can make a great case for themselves. Manny will most likely win fighter of the year honors, due to his victory over DLH a fresh memory in the minds of voters, just like the movie that comes out in December to win the Oscar for Best Picture.

All five of these fighters had victories over fellow p4p champs, but the difference being that Margarito, Hopkins and Darchinyan absolutely destroyed their p4p opponents who all happened to be in their prime, whereas Manny and Calzaghe both had controversial victories over their p4p opponents that many had the other fighter winning.

2008 Final p4p Ratings
*Note: I determine p4p rating based on skill set along with natural athletic talent such as speed, power and reflexes.

1. Hopkins
2. Pacquiao
3. Calzaghe
4. JMM
5. Margarito
6. Vasquez
7. Cotto
8. Hatton
9. Darchinyan
10. Abraham
11. Dawson
12. R. Marquez
13. Klitschko
14. Williams
15. Kessler
16. Pavlik
17. Caballero
18. Campbell
19. Calderon
20. Juanma Lopez

I'm sure many will disagree with Hopkins at #1, however it is my opinion that his skill set is beyond anyone elses from offense to defense to ring generalship to ring intelligence and this is only proven further by how effective he still is at 43 years old, when his speed, power and reflexes have definitely deteriorated and are no longer anywhere close to what they were even five years ago. To me, that is what defines p4p. I can't imagine any fighter from any other era (at least off the top of my head, though I'm sure someone will point one out) that would still be this effective at 43 years old against elite competition.

As for the inclusion of Abraham, he has been on a tear, destroying and stopping quality opposition at MW for the last two years. Same goes for Klitschko, he has an excellent skill set and is only getting better, with his real weakness being his chin as many think and his anxiety when he gets hard, still he has quality and dominant wins over a number of top-10 HWs in the last two years as well.

Thanks for reading. Thought?
Click to expand...

viperguy, Dec 9, 2008

#31

coupdegrace Active Member Full Member

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b hop fighter of the year? :?

coupdegrace, Dec 9, 2008

#32

coupdegrace Active Member Full Member

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waah.. :shock: didn't notice your p4p list, b-hop also at no.1? though i give the performance of the year to b-hop p4p no.1 is sure as hell absurd. tell me what ur smokin lately and spit out b-hops nuts off your mouth.

coupdegrace, Dec 9, 2008

#33
owell Active Member Full Member

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Can't beat JC. Beaten an American media hype fighter and now Fighter of the Year!?!?!?...

owell, Dec 9, 2008

#34

owell Active Member Full Member

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If Pavlik was any good he should have beaten a faded 43 years old B-hop or at least was able to hang on with him. Just shows Pavlik was never the elite fighter he was hyped by the media/press.

owell, Dec 9, 2008

#35
Adaptation Well-Known Member Full Member

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Fighter of the year is Pacquiao for sure.

FOTY Vazquez Marquez III

Performance HAS to be bernard vs Kelly. Slick ass 43 year old's.

Adaptation, Dec 9, 2008

#36
scatterbrain Boxing Addict Full Member

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pacman fighter of the year.

but hand in to bhop. 43 year old whipping a prime pavlik.

bhop can be a grand dad for all we know. or is he?

scatterbrain, Dec 9, 2008

#37

kirk l l l Staff Member

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Great post man.... like how you layed all that out

kirk, Dec 9, 2008

#38
kirk l l l Staff Member

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jericojuliolab said: ↑

Crap boxing year, crap boxing fan, crap tread starter.

Am not a boxing expert but reading above list is ridiculous. Don't believe you can get 25% of boxing expert here in ESB to agree with you.
Click to expand...

crap boxing year???? are you ****ing kidding me?

Vasquez vs Marquez 3
Margarito vs Cotto
Pac vs JMM 2
Hopkins vs Pavlik
Pac vs Hoya (say what you want about the fight, it was still monumental)
Holt vs Torres 2
Darchinyan vs Mijares
Hopkins vs JC (even if it was a crap fight, it was a significant matchup)

atschatschatschatschatsch

kirk, Dec 9, 2008

#39
hooligan Millionaire Bum Full Member

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blood_lust said: ↑

As 2008 winds down there have been some great performances by underdogs and favorites alike. Manny ended the year on a high note with his beat down of DLH. However, that wasn't even the most impressive performance of the year in my opinion. Here are my top performances, fighter of the year ratings and final p4p of 2008.

Performance of the Year

1. Hopkins UD12 Pavlik - What else can you say but a good old fashion ass-whooping'. Hopkins, at 43 years old, was able to dominate a prime and UNDEFEATED Pavlik, and landed the elusive bolo punch!!! I can't imagine any other fighter from any era being able to do what he did to Pavlik at 43 years old. On top of this Pavlik was top-10 p4p fighter and Hopkins was the underdog as well.

2. Margarito KO11 Cotto - Margarito absolutely took over Cotto after the 7th and destroyed a prime and UNDEFEATED Cotto who was ranked in the top-5 p4p at the time. Margarito was the underdog too.

3. Darchinyan KO9 Mijares - Darchinyan moved up in weight and absolutely dominated and stopped a prime and top-10 p4p champion in Mijares. A brilliant performance.

4. Caballero TKO4 Molitor - Caballero went to Molitor's backyard and destroyed (quite possibly ruined too) Molitor in a short and brutal one-sided fight. Molitor was in his prime, an undefeated champion and had star potential written all over him. The result was a shock to everyone.

5. Pacquiao TKO9 De La Hoya - Manny moved up 12 pounds in weight to beat a past prime DLH worse than anyone not named Hopkins. It was an annihilation of the Golden boy and Manny was the underdog to boot. The only real negatives were as Freddie Roach himself put it, DLH "had no legs, was hesitant, he was shot" and DLH wouldn't be ranked in the top-5 at WW. DLH couldn't pull the trigger, but that's not Manny's fault and he looked AWESOME in stopping DLH!

6. Haye TKO2 Maccarinelli - Haye absolutely destroyed the #1 CW in brutal and quick fashion. A spectacular KO over a top CW champ.

7. Vitali Klitschko RTD9 Peter - Vitali comes back after 4 years of retirement to completely dominate the most feared puncher at HW and a top 3 HW at the time.

8. Marquez TKO11 Casamayor - Marquez came through in a competitive fight against one of the rings greats in Casamayor and became the first to stop him. Though Casamayor was past his prime, he was still recognized as the linear champ, a real threat coming off a great victory over Katsidis and Marquez moved up in weight to beat the "man" at 135.

9. Dawson UD12 Tarver - Dawson dominated former LHV champ Tarver who was coming off a quality victory over Clinton Woods. Though not the same fighter that destroyed Roy Jones Jr., he still was a dangerous fighter.

10. Calzaghe UD12 RJJ - Except for a flash knockdown, he dominated RJJ from round 2 - 12. He Roy Jones Jr'd the real RJJ. At first glance, many would rate this higher on the list, but as most know, RJJ was wayyyyyyy past his prime, but still a great victory, though not as dominant a victory as either Tarver's or Glen Johnson's, both of which were over a younger RJJ.

Those are my top-10 and I'm sure I missed a couple of performances. I left out the performances by Vasquez and others as they were great fights and performances, the ones I mentioned were all one-sided or very close to one sided with dramatic endings. Additionally, I'm sure many will flame me for placing Pacman's victory over DLH at #5, I place much more value on dominating a prime fighter versus a dominating a long and tooth fighter, regardless of the perceived weight advantages/disadvantages.

Fighter of the year

As for my fighters of the year. The top-4 are interchangeable in my mind and you can make a case for any of them being #1:

1. Margarito - Two dominating KO performances over prime and hungry top-5 WW belt holders in Cintron and Cotto, with Cotto being in the top-5 p4p at the time.

2. Hopkins - A dominating performance over Pavlik who was in his prime and in the p4p to-10 at the time and a very controversial SD loss (I had him winning as did most of press row) against a younger and fresher Calzaghe, who is arguably the greatest SMW of all-time and was ranked in the top-3 p4p at the the time. Two fights against two top-10 p4p fighters all at the age of 43 years old!

3. Darchinyan - Dominated and stopped two champs in Kirilov and Mijares who were both in their prime and top-3 in the division, with Mijares being a top-10 p4p ranked fighter at the time. Utter domination and KO'd both guys. You can't ask for more.

4. Pacquiao - A very close and controversial win over Marquez ( I had Marquez winning as did most of press row) who was top-5 p4p fighter at the time, a dominating KO against a top-5 belt holder at 135 in Diaz and a beat down of a long-in-tooth De La Hoya in a fight he moved up 12 pounds in. Great year for Manny.

5. Calzaghe - Very close and controversial win over Hopkins, who was top-5 p4p at the time and a dominating victory over a shot RJJ. Great year, but not as good as the four mentioned above.

Like I said before and of these guys can make a great case for themselves. Manny will most likely win fighter of the year honors, due to his victory over DLH a fresh memory in the minds of voters, just like the movie that comes out in December to win the Oscar for Best Picture.

All five of these fighters had victories over fellow p4p champs, but the difference being that Margarito, Hopkins and Darchinyan absolutely destroyed their p4p opponents who all happened to be in their prime, whereas Manny and Calzaghe both had controversial victories over their p4p opponents that many had the other fighter winning.

2008 Final p4p Ratings
*Note: I determine p4p rating based on skill set along with natural athletic talent such as speed, power and reflexes.

1. Hopkins
2. Pacquiao
3. Calzaghe
4. JMM
5. Margarito
6. Vasquez
7. Cotto
8. Hatton
9. Darchinyan
10. Abraham
11. Dawson
12. R. Marquez
13. Klitschko
14. Williams
15. Kessler
16. Pavlik
17. Caballero
18. Campbell
19. Calderon
20. Juanma Lopez

I'm sure many will disagree with Hopkins at #1, however it is my opinion that his skill set is beyond anyone elses from offense to defense to ring generalship to ring intelligence and this is only proven further by how effective he still is at 43 years old, when his speed, power and reflexes have definitely deteriorated and are no longer anywhere close to what they were even five years ago. To me, that is what defines p4p. I can't imagine any fighter from any other era (at least off the top of my head, though I'm sure someone will point one out) that would still be this effective at 43 years old against elite competition.

As for the inclusion of Abraham, he has been on a tear, destroying and stopping quality opposition at MW for the last two years. Same goes for Klitschko, he has an excellent skill set and is only getting better, with his real weakness being his chin as many think and his anxiety when he gets hard, still he has quality and dominant wins over a number of top-10 HWs in the last two years as well.

Thanks for reading. Thought?
Click to expand...

i give you a "A" for presentation...but i give you a "C-" for content...

calslappy-rjj a performance of the year candidate? - laughable

pacman jumping from one division to another in his 3 fights and winning them is not a fighter of the year #1 is just utterly dumb...

hopkins p4p #1 based on skill set?...shiiit dont tell me he's faster than pac?(definitely not)...more durable than margarito? (maybe)...i can go on an on...hopkins aint #1 p4p thats for sure...

hooligan, Dec 10, 2008

#40
SouthpawSlayer Im coming for you Full Member

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pauliemayweathe said: ↑

agree...it goes pac...rest of boxing for 2008
Click to expand...

same as

SouthpawSlayer, Dec 10, 2008

#41

berserkafied Active Member Full Member

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Adaptation said: ↑

Fighter of the year is Pacquiao for sure.

FOTY Vazquez Marquez III

Performance HAS to be bernard vs Kelly. Slick ass 43 year old's.
Click to expand...

I'll go with this.

berserkafied, Dec 10, 2008

#42
theDUD3 Active Member Full Member

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As I explained before, I had him beating Calzaghe for starters, but beyond that, p4p is defined by skill set more so than, speed, power or reflexes in my mind.
Click to expand...

then calderon should be your P4P #1.

theDUD3, Dec 10, 2008

#43
ali's jockstrap Member Full Member

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theDUD3 said: ↑

then calderon should be your P4P #1.
Click to expand...

if that is the case surely david haye should be in your p4p top 20!!

ali's jockstrap, Dec 10, 2008

#44
BOONDOCK SAINT Active Member Full Member

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angelos said: ↑

its crazy to put names other than pacquio as their fighter of the year.
Click to expand...

i agree this is a long nonsense thread

more margo nut-tarzans

BOONDOCK SAINT, Dec 10, 2008

#45

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