Harder To Stop Part I: Best Chin & Defence - Peak Hopkins or Peak Toney?

You made it a public poll, did you not?

 

Been a while since I've seen either fight, and you could be right, but it's definitely not the way I remember it. I thought Hopkins was in serious trouble against Mercado. I don't think Toney was in any sort of trouble against Johnson. He just got stunned with a shot he wasn't expecting and was back to normal a few seconds later.

 

Toney feigned being OK against Johnson, but he was clearly acting, as shown by the extremely rubbery legs he showed in the next tie-up where he nearly went over again. He did recover shortly thereafter though, after regaining his senses.

 

I just put on Toney-Johnson right now and I have to admit Toney was a bit more than just stunned for a few seconds. He was rubber legged there for a while. Never in danger of being stopped but definitely hurt.

Still agree though that Hopkins was in more trouble.

 

Toney looked notably hurt for about 30 seconds against Johnson(who was featherfisted) imo.

Enough that had it been a Hagler or Hearns he very likely wouldn't be getting out of the round.Mind you i think Hearns would have one punched him if he caught him with a similar shot he doesn't see coming.

I'd say both are on about the same level as far as being hard to stop goes.Toney has the better radar and is more of a virtuoso defensively, where Hopkins is tidy, versatile and functional.

Toney's lack of footwork will always hold him back in these kind of comparisons.

 

Getting hit like that on the break can't be held against him.

In terms of the "gun to the head" scenario here, I'll take Hopkins as more difficult to stop.

 

Hmm, this is a public poll? It's not letting me see the picks.

 

You have to click on the numbers.

 

Plain and simple, Toney's main defense is his ability to stay compact and roll away from the punches thrown. Taking little of the actual brunt of the shots...but the problem with that is, he is within range of a fighter actually throwing punches.

Hopkins on the other hand is alot more complicated in the way he stays defensive. His main thing is movement. Against Trinidad, he moved exclusively to the left, making it impossible for Tito to sit down on anything (and vs Pavlik, it was exclusively to the right)...not to mention the awkward angles he gives his opponents, again making it impossible to really sit on anything with power. Basically...his defense isnt just about making him hard to hit...its making it hard for you to even throw.

See, with Toney, you dont see a fighter's offense disappearing...with Bernard's, you do.

Also, as good as Toney is at rolling with the punches, so to say...Hopkins is equally good at keeping his chin tucked at all times. Even on offense. Its amazing to see. His lead right is always accompanied by a tucked chin, making it hard to hurt him with a counter, if he were to miss.

One last reason I have to give credit to McGrain for pointing out to me.

When Hopkins goes on offense, his footwork is so perfect that he is able to get back into defensive position faster than anyone I have ever seen. Watch any of his fights...just as he is finishing his attack, he is already setting his feet back defensively, already keeping the chin tucked, already ready to either defend or counter. Its tough to fully explain, but if you watch for it, you will see what I mean.

So defensively, Hopkins is head and shoulders above Toney. BUT, Toney has faced the far bigger punchers and has been hurt less times than fingers I have on one hand. His chin isnt just better than Bernard's (who's also has an ATG chin), but its one of the best the sport has ever seen (which coincidently, is what I feel about Hopkins defense).

The real answer to this question honestly...is neither. These are two fighters that I doubt we will see get stopped. Unless Toney keeps fighting...because honestly, after watching him fight Oquendo (god that was an awful display), I believe he is DONE and needs to hang them up before he gets hurt badly.

But prime for prime, I dont think either man could ever get stopped.

Gun to my head, I say Bernard...for the fact that he is so much better at taking the opponent's offense away, where as Toney is amazing at defending against it.

 

Toneys only been down twice right? RJJ and that other guy can't remember his name.

Hopkins was down several times against Mercado.

I have to say Toneys chin is better, as he's gone up to heavyweight to test it out, I think Hopkins would've been kayoed by some of the heavyweights Toney fought.

 

Hopkins was down twice vs Mercado...due mostly to conditioning problems caused by the altitude in Ecuador. Once hurt, once off balance.

Toney was down vs Johnson, Jones and Peter. Twice hurt, once off balance.

And I dont think ANY HW that Toney fought KOs Bernard....sorry.