Time to REVAMP boxing!

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Utter1, Dec 30, 2008.


  1. Utter1

    Utter1 Active Member Full Member

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    Mar 5, 2006
    Hi guys ive just come back from Las Vegas with family for a xmas vacation and back in good old england.

    On saturday night i watched the UFC in a sports bar, and it was packed to the rafters.

    I noticed several things......the sport of MMA is catching up to the standard of boxing and that MMA is better ran.

    Obviously UFC has a monopoly on MMA but hopefully other org pop up to proceed with further exciting fights.

    W. Silva fought Rampage Jackson for the 3rd time......how often do elite level boxers fight each other that often.

    In fact one thing i noticed with MMA is that the best fight the best all the time......there fight records are nothing in comparasion to Boxing BUT the quality of oppoenets is high end.

    MMA still does not have the depth that boxing does......but this could soon be nullified with the way MMA is going. Big respect!

    BUT im a boxing man.........i still believe that if i had to take 5 men from the history of combat sport with me to a fight and back me up........4 of the 5 would be boxers.......Lewis, Ali, Tyson, Foreman......with Fedor from MMA aswell.

    I had a lightbulb moment whilst watching the UFC card.

    Why dont us fans.....in some mass particpation try to force boxing to change it ways......to keep up with modern sports, and life.

    We saw how Pacamn beat De La Hoya......everyone spoke of 3 weight divisions......but if u really think about it........there isnt 3 weights divisions betweeen them.......there is one.....lightweight and welterweight.

    We have created so many divisions.......that we marval when a fighter jumps up......but whats happened is.......fighters being able to avoid other fighters whilst keep a version of the belt.
     
  2. Utter1

    Utter1 Active Member Full Member

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    Mar 5, 2006
    Roughly thinking about it.........weight divisions 100 years ago or more.....were created by judging the current weights of men etc.

    (IF someone could give me dates etc to when the heavyweight, middleweight etc were created it would help this healthy debate)

    Why dont we re-zone weight and have less weight divisions-

    Rough idea-

    Lightweight - 140 and below

    Welterweight - 160 and below

    Middlweight - 185 and below

    Light heavyweight - 210 and below

    Heavyweight - 210 or more

    Most debate will say that its unfair on guys that weight 126.....etc......but these guys can easily add 4 or 5 pounds......and having 6 pound weight difference in the light weight division is nothing....it makes interesting fights.

    Regardless of weather De La Hoya was past it or not......Pacaman used speed, reflex etc to beat the slight bigger guy,
    why cant 126 or 130 up there game?

    If we looked at Cotto.......many would say he would be stuck as he is too big for 140 and to small for 160...........but surely this would mean he would have to up his game....if not then he fades.........i just thinking boxing needs to go back to basics.

    Hell keep the 4 main orgs........but why dont they togeather create a world commision where they discuess, school boxing programs, free tv ideas, and pensions.

    Why dont they take from Vince McMahon and make a weekly scheudle of free tv fights for the up and comers around the world?
     
  3. 1Kolijn

    1Kolijn Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Dec 7, 2007
    I'm with you. something needs to happen!
     
  4. FlatNose

    FlatNose Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Feb 16, 2006
    Hey, if you like MMA go watch it. To me , it's a bunch of jacks of all trades, masters of none. I mean, boxings only been around since the first Olympics 776 BC.
    True, there is a drought in the showcase division, but the lighter weights are still jamming. Give me Pacquio-Hatton anyday over a 10th ranked former college wrestler against some obscure Jui-Jitsu dude sitting on each others chest pounding one another in the face.
     
  5. PaddyD1983

    PaddyD1983 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Dec 24, 2007
    I take your point generally that boxing needs to up its game and get back mainstream, but I think in the UK, its pretty healthy at the moment. It sounds like the US is suffering from the MMA vibe but havent really seen that hit over here (yet? maybe).

    I think the main issue is the lack of boxing on terrestrial TV and the lack of media coverage in general. Other than Barry McGuigan and Frank Warren, are there any regular columnists in tabloid (or for that matter) broadsheet newspapers? Prior to Buncey's Boxing hour was there a flagship boxing programme on any network let alone terrestrial TV? Prior to Carl Froch on ITV, when was the last title fight live on terrestrial TV?

    To be fair, I think boxing is already going someway to rectify this with Setanta showing quite a few fights, Sky still showing British boxing and then the Froch fight as mentioned. But what I think is needed are a couple of things...

    1. Promoters who are willing to take a little less money in return for a little more exposure by putting fights on terrestrial TV rather than paid for services.

    2. The return of regional titles. I think this could really add some interest at a local level. Imagine if North West, North East, West Midlands, East Midlands, South West, South East and maybe a couple for London - had a regional champion. Then North v South. Then up the ladder of British, EBU etc etc as it is already. Adds some local interest and gets people to know names of fighters. Put these on BBC2 and everyone's watching it!

    Not sure about your comments on the weights though. These were introduced to make boxing safer and more competitive. There will always be someone who uses the weights to their advantage but I wouldnt fancy throwing a 108lb boxer in with Ricky Hatton. Oh... hang on a minute...
     
  6. P.4.P.G.O.A.T.

    P.4.P.G.O.A.T. Q Boro Killa Bee Full Member

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    Oct 10, 2007
    All good points man - there are definintely too many divisions, and it creates these decade long black holes - like in the 154 pound division. Too many sanctioning bodies too. But two other major forces that keep the sport the way it is are promoters and TV networks. A fight does not get made without these two entities - it's a big problem....
     
  7. Jetset78

    Jetset78 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Jul 30, 2007
    Its no so much the number of weight divisons that bother me but rather the number of different versions of the title.

    Keep the weights as they are but have just one world title belt per divison.
     
  8. machinebus

    machinebus Member Full Member

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    Sep 6, 2005
    LOL :yep
     
  9. Utter1

    Utter1 Active Member Full Member

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    Mar 5, 2006
    It would force fighters to atually fight-

    Its crazy that Marg beats cotto but then in a sense avoids P. Williams

    Mayweather beats hatton and Hoya but never takes on Cotto, Williams, marg

    Will pavlik take on Abraham?

    No one is immune......the way boxing is organised....its lets the top fighter get overpaid and then dicate to much.

    How do we know Mayweater beats Cotto? We can only specualate........and i find that a shame......i personally think Mawayweater outboxes him but HELL its just speculation.

    Anyhow i thought about this and.... the division make perfect sense...i walk around at around 190 with body fat of 14 per cent....i roughly consider myself a middlweight in today world......but with the way boxing organises itself it would make a me a bloody cruiserweight.....no way am i in the upper echelon of the heavier guys.

    Hoya isnt a middle nor is Pavlik they all look like welterweight guys intoday world.....same wit Taver......he looks like a middlweight guy.....anyhow.

    I also thought they should make gloves 6 ounces.....no higher no lower......it leads of more knockouts and less pitta patta.

    A world commison is organised laying the foundation of rules and it dosent rank fighter or gain money from fighters......just a place for the main 4 to meet and discuss new ideas every year etc.

    Have the 5 basic weight divisions-

    Lets look at what we would have hpothetically (wrong spelling) and need to think of what guys would do as in up there weight or go down a weight.

    140 and below- Lightweights (NO ranking order)
    1.Pacman
    2.Hatton
    3.J.M.Marqez
    4. V. Darchinyan
    5. I. Vazquez
    6. D. Diaz
    7. M.A.Barrera
    8. N. Campbell
    9. Z. Judah
    10. E. Valero

    160 and below- welterweights

    1. Cotto
    2. P. Williams
    3. Margarito
    4. Mayweather
    5. Pavlik
    6. Abraham
    7. De La Hoya
    8. Cintron
    9. S. Mosley
    10. A. Berto
    11. F. Sturm
    12. W. Wright

    185 and below- Middlweights-
    1. Kessler
    2. Calzaghe
    3. Hopkins
    4. Johnson
    5. Tarver
    6. Bute
    7. Froch
    8. J. Taylor
    9. J. Lacy
    10. C. Dawson

    210 and below- Light heavies
    1. E. Chambers
    2. J.M.Mormeck
    3. E. Macarenelli
    4. E. Holyfield (he might decide to come down a weight)
    5. G. Gragomeni
    6. S. Cunningham
    7. Adamek
    8. Alekseev
    9. S. Ibragimov (another guy who might cut weight)
    10. H. Hide
    11. Roy Jonesjner (or just complety past it maybe)

    210 and above.....is pretty much the same.........

    Anyhow this is pure speculation and some fighters to some wouldnt be there and some would. The main thing is! Look at the bloody talent in each division by god would we get to see the best fight the best.......forced to go into combat......with just 4 belts up for grab per divison......and its a real division something you were meant for in the literal sense.....how can u go from lightweight to middlewight if ur frame is up to it? We are stuck with what they have given us......we feel lucky if we have a super fight......but dam we should have it every month.
     
  10. djc1289

    djc1289 Member Full Member

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    Sep 6, 2008
    Boxing is the best sport in the world and is perfect as it is. My only issue with the sport is the amount of belts, which is a bit silly, they should cut it back to one or two. And there should be some rule around ducking fights, so that people like Valuev dont become long reigning world champions when they shouldn't even have the title in the first place, coz as it stands Wlad and Vitali Klitschko should hold all belts coz they r the best! I dont like the fact you only have to be one of the best to be a world champion you should be THE best
     
  11. Utter1

    Utter1 Active Member Full Member

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    Mar 5, 2006

    I think the posts have gone by you somewhat.......i wanted to generate a discussion on how we can up the game of boxing.

    Look at my post -

    Im a boxing fan

    I box myself amateur

    I like to look around at other sports and see there methods for making the sport more appealing-

    Tennis 40 years ago didnt even have pros....now look at it 4 majors...with a load of atp circuit.

    MMA has done alot of good......its made interesting insights....that we can learn from.

    I just want to a get a feeling with everyone about how we can revamp the sport........hell the weight divisions.......are just my opion...........you make it 135 - 147 - 168 for all i care but the main thing is to have just 5 or 6......no more.

    Caveman thinking - Light weights - (the little guys)

    middleweight ( ah medium sized guys)

    heavy ( the big boys)

    What the hell is a suppermiddlweight or flyweight? super batam to cruiser?
     
  12. Utter1

    Utter1 Active Member Full Member

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    Mar 5, 2006

    I agree......but im sure us fans.....the hardcore can think of something....heck the internet is a powerful tool.......if you can 100 thousand fans petition and change..........who know what we could achieve.

    I just want the best for boxing
     
  13. venomus_p4p

    venomus_p4p Guest


    You are so right... that would SUCK for Cotto. He's way to small for 160 given his style and strengths. And he cant make 140 anymore which would be where the guys his height would be.
     
  14. Predicto

    Predicto Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Oct 15, 2008
    Imagine how great boxing could be if it were run by a single body like the UFC.

    1) Fewer weight classes 2) Only ONE champ in each class! 3) The best MUST fight each other 4) Full-value PPV "events"... not just 1 big fight with a shite undercard
     
  15. gigogreco

    gigogreco Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Jun 21, 2008
    make a 10 pound difference in the lower weigh classes, its crazy som divisions are only separated by merely 4 pounds..

    make 120-130-140-150-160-170

    when we go higher up in weight , then i feel it would be fair, to make the weight jump a little higher..

    perhaps make the jump the next 185, and the nexr 205..

    i think its more to do with, the way boxing is organized, its slowly going to be matched and surpassed by mma..

    mma perhaps is, what boxing once was..