Joe has evey right to hold a grudge against Ali. He may have joke with say Folly or Liston, but with Frazier, he took it to a other level. You dont call a person a Tom, or a Ape. Ali knew what he was doing. Ali paint Frazier as the white man's hero, but relly Frazier is more black than Ali.
Ditto. Frazier may be a **** nowadays but that doesn't change the fact that Ali was a **** in the 1970s.
The cell phone message was actually 'I'm smokin' Joe Frazier, sharp as a razor, float like a butterfly, sting like a bee, I'm the man who donethe job, he knows look and see.'
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=fODYeoHvH4I&feature=related Heres part 1 the rest of the parts are there
Plus ferdie pacheco proved what a horrible individual he is.Why could'nt he of just answered the question's instead of being smart.He never come across like this years ago, perhaps its old age, i dont know, but to think it was funny what ali done and to run joe down dont make him look good!
Yeah, I was suprised by Freddie`s comments but I think he was basically sticking up for Ali as all the crew associated with Frazier were sticking up for Joe.
Pacheco is an absolute ****. Just out of interest, who do you guys consider to have been the true winner of the Thrilla In Manilla. I know officially Ali won, but I honestly think is Futch hadn't of pulled Frazier out, he would of won. I mean Frazier didn't want to quit at all, but Futch thought he had had enough. I'm pretty sure Ali, even though Frazier was getting beaten up, wouldn't of come out for the 15th. I mean he fainted after the 14th when it was announced he had won, and he talk Angelo Dundee he didn't want to continue and would refuse to go out for the last round. What do you guys reckon would of happened if Futch had let Frazier continue?
Man, that documentary really does a number on many a poor ignorant sods. Just to get it straight, Ali never told Dundee he wanted to quit after the 14:th. That is somehting that has come later. It was after the 10:th that he said he wanted to quit, but instead went out and turned the fight around.
The stoppage was fortuitous for Ali. Years later, Wali Muhammad, one of Ali's cornermen in Manila, acknowledged: 'After the 14th, Ali came back to the corner and told us, "Cut 'em off". That's how tired he was. He wanted us to cut his gloves off. Angelo [Ali's trainer] ignored him. He started wiping Ali's face, getting him ready for the 15th. We sponged him down. I don't know if he'd have gone out for the last round or not. Ali's not a quitter; he'd never quit. But I'd never seen him exhausted like that before.' 'Frazier quit just before I did,' Ali told me in 1990. 'I didn't think I could fight any more.'
It was a great documentary put they described FOTC as a one sided beat down, but Frazier ate so many right hands in that fight. It was not one-sided.
Yeah, that was the story that emerged years later. But "My Dinner with Conteh" (profilic poster here) have the articles that was written after the fight, and according to them he said it after the 10:th. That's also more or less what's said in Ali's autobiography from 1976, if I remember correctly. For my money, those sources are far more reliable than what's said 15 years later. Memory is a fickle thing, and it makes for a better story saying that Ali wanted to quit after the 14:th. Doesn't make it true, though.