Could Mayweather have hung with Chavez in the pocket?

Floyd Mayweather Jr. would not be able to successfully stand in the pocket against Julio Cesar Chavez. Mayweather's speed, defense, and counter punching ability would allow him moments; but it would not be near enough. Chavez did not smother his own punches on the inside, like Ricky Hatton sometimes does. Chavez was very good at getting into his preferred range, and unleashing what might have been the best offense in boxing history.

Mayweather's best chance would be to fight Chavez in a manner that would infuriate the fans, similar to his victory over Baldomir. I personally don't believe that Mayweather has the chin to defeat Chavez. I believe Chavez will catch Mayweather with significant shots here and there in the first half of the fight, that cause Mayweather to stand still long enough for Chavez to unleash debilitating combinations. I believe Mayweather will be forced to fight on the inside when the fight reaches the 9th round, and Chavez stops him in the 11th.

 

Its interesting people point to a Castillo fight where FMJ was injured and fighting his first real test at 135, and don't look at Chavez's bigger problems with speedy boxers

Chavez lost to:

Whitaker - pretty much schooled. Chavez fans like to point to it being at WW, simple fact is Chavez couldnt handle those skills, speed, movement, defense at any weight. Its debatable who's better between Whitaker/Mayweather, I see Whitaker as better personally by a small margin. But Mayweather has similar abilities, faster hands and more power. Some say JCC was past prime, he was 31, Whitaker 29

Randall - beat him twice (that quit job by Chavez) fighting in the pocket and countering with flush shots. People say Chavez was past prime but he was only 32 and Randal was 32. FMJ plays this role far better than Randall without a doubt

Taylor - we all know Taylor was winning widely until the controversal stoppage. Chavez was 27 in his prime. Guess what FMJ isn't leaving his chin out to dry in the last round while way ahead on the cards.

Delahoya - simply dominated, albeit past his prime and by a bigger man

So based on Chavez's worst performances I could say FMJ schools JCC and makes him quit ala Randal. I mean thats what people do with FMJ, so fairs fair and Chavez's weak performances are well, weaker!

 

What has size goto do with those performances, all of the opponents started out at LW, Castillo weighs more in the ring than possibly any of those opponents

 

Perhaps Chavez looked so good at 130-135 was because he was facing lesser opponents?

 

Of all the fighters that I have ever watched, Chavez and Joe Louis are the two offenses that I have been most impressed with. I think Louis was a better puncher, with a better jab; but there are some similarities. Chavez and Louis were always consistent, and used a great blend of shots upstairs and down. They are the truest examples of doling out systematic destructions.

As far as speed and power are concerned, you can name numerous fighters that are greater than Chavez. However; all of Chavez' blows had a lingering effect, and he balanced his attack like no other. He was always in search and destroy mode, and had beating his opponent up down to a science.

 

Are you saying Chavez wasnt in his prime at 27? And didnt FMJ claim to have problems with his shoulder, hand and broken ribs during the first fight? You can hear Roger say between rounds 'I know your shoulder is out but your going to have to bite down and use it'.

The fact remains against the faster and slicker boxers JCC came up short time and again, while FMJ beat every pressure fighter he faced, 3 of which were P4P

 

Yes the best offense in boxing history, yet not huge powerful or particularly quick or the highest of workrates :nut

I'll come out and say FMJ has a better offense than Chavez (not that he is as offensively minded)

 

Chavez, as pointed out, was no longer at his best weight, and was slowed down by injuries at this point in his career, included a back injury that took away a lot of his ability to move and cut off the ring. (And that's not bringing up things like the drug habits and such).

As far as the prime thing goes, you either must be kidding about the age, or aren't aware that it was Chavez' 88th professional fight and Whitaker's 34th.

Guess you weren't kidding about the prime thing. Well, in Randall's case it's at least closer as Randall had 51 pro fights when they first met, as opposed to being Chavez' 91st. The Oscar example I'm not even going to touch because it should be obvious why that has no bearing on this conversation, anymore than, say, Ali-Spinks or Ali-Holmes does in talking about how Ali does against another boxer in a prime for prime matchup.

If we're really going to be fair about this, lets compare how Floyd looks after 80+ or 90+ fights and then say why various people would beat him. Or lets actually stick to the dates and primes specified.

For my own opinion on the fight, Chavez has a lot of problems with speed and slickness, and Floyd has that in spades. The question becomes does Floyd survive down the stretch, and this gets dicey because of Floyd's style of defense, which has him frequently standing still in front of his opponent and doing the shoulder roll to deflect punches rather than getting out of the way entirely. Prime Chavez was not a wild brawler, (although for some reason a lot of people like to think of him that way, probably because of his come forward style) but a very surgical and methodical puncher with great accuracy and a talent for picking his spots, so Floyd would be putting himself in harm's way if he did employ his usual defensive style.

Still, I think that unless Floyd did something stupid or let himself get physically broken down, he could eke a decision by using speed and smarts, although Chavez would make it close down the stretch and really punish Floyd for it. Of course, the smartest and easiest way for Floyd to win would be by not staying in the pocket. If he wants to win and not **** blood or have his prime shortened, he would be staying on the move and out of the pocket. (Which he would probably be smart enough to do, I think. At least at first).

 

1. Everyone has injuries its part of boxing. Mayweather himself has had massive injury problems with hands/shoulder, especially against Castillo 1. His hand/shoulder problems are possibly why he pot shotted far more in his late career. How was 140 not Chavez's best weight? He could no longer make 135, hence was at 140 at 27 (Taylor).

2. Whitaker according to him had 534+ bouts by that stage amateur and pro, Chavez only had 88. Many of Whitakers amateurs bouts will have been far harder than Chavez's 0-0 taxi drivers he beat up on. Put in that context Chavez's 88bouts mean little

3. Again Chavez's had no amateur career so fought more learning fights and fought more no hopers, this doesn't age him as a fighter, it sharpens him. Randall had mroe amateur fights. Both were the same age

4. I said Chavez was past prime, but not by anything like as much as ALi-Spinks, lets not be silly. The manner of the domination was a little humiliating, and it was again due to the speed of the opponent

5. Floyd's fought far far more fights than Chavez (amateur and pro). FMJ fought 20+ title fights over 10years without loss, Chavez should have lost his first title bout after 6years (Taylor) and then 9 years in (Whitaker) before losing 10years in (Randal)

PS I agree with your analysis somewhat

 

Are we taking into consideration that Mayweather was injured in his fight with castillo, whereas before the injury he dominated the first fight against Castillo? And he dominated the rematch??