{<Where is Evander Holyfield in ATG HW rankings?}>

I stand by my unpopular opinion that Holyfield is often overrated at heavyweight. He was a fantastic cruiser. At heawvyweight, he is liked so much for his heart and ring wars, but he was in those and had to show so much heart because he rarely dominated like Lennox Lewis, a young Tyson, Ali and others.

He fought the best competition of any HW in the last 20 years but he lost four out of five against the two best fighters of his era (unless you think the first Lewis fight was really a draw). Over multiple fights against the same opponent, he has a negative record against Bowe and Lewis, a neutral one against Moorer and Ruiz and only a positive one against Tyson. So he basically failed to establish himself as superior over multiple fights against four out of five fighters of his era. His KO ratio at heavyweight is pretty low.

Holyfield got away with more cheating than most fighters. I cheered for him like crazy when he fought Tyson, but years later and with a more sober look, I rewatched the fight several times. Tyson led until Holyfield headbutted and then low blowed him in the sixth. Holyfield might have won just with his heart and skills, but he did foul twice in the round when he turned the fight around. Sure, you can argue that this is an overly critical look at things, but just imagine Wladimir Klitschko would trail against Haye, then fouls and turns the fight around...boxing fans would be all over him and diminish his victory. Holyfield also clinched much more against Tyson than Wlad did against Peter, yet everybody praises Holy for his heroic win while Wlad gets so much **** for clinching against Peter.

While we may assume that HGH and steroids are used by many other fighters, in Holyfield's case the evidence is overwhelming and, more importantly, with his body type he obviously benefitted immensely from drugs. If you look at Holyfield as an amateur, it is hard to envision this man going toe to toe with Foreman, Bowe or Tyson. He gained an amount of muscle mass that would be difficult for a ure boybuilder to attain without drugs. I doubt that Holyfield, given his physical fighting style, would have accomplished much at heaveyweight naturally. Natural HW's can sometimes even diminish their performance by using steroids, I strongly assume that's what happened to Shannon Briggs.

Holyfield was a great champion nevertheless, but some people rate him over Lewis or Homes, which I find ridiculous. He might be top 15, not top 10 in my opinion.

 

had holyfield fought at HW at the start of his career, he could have accomplish more in the HW...

 

I currently have Holyfield at 8, one place below Lewis, however after his 'Evan Fields' alter ego was exposed he should maybe get booted out of the ATG list altogether.

 

his HW is #9 but his ATG is ahead of holmes, foreman and frazier

 

What annoys me even more about this saga is the comments he made years ago about Tyson.

Here's the article-

http://www.***********.com/?m=show&id=7773

 

Foreman and Homes are above Holyfield. Foreman was a dominant KO artist in his first career while Holyfield had to gut out wins in life and death fights most of the time. Foreman then accomplished the most amazing comeback of an old fighter in the history of the sport, something Holyfield is trying in vain to accomplish.

To keep the title for seven years like Holmes is a greater accomplishment than losing it and winning it back mutliple times.

 

Sure, and if Vitali could trick the scale by learning how to levitate, he would be unbeatable at welterweight...

What kind of silly argument is this? Holyfield is not a natural heavyweight, if he had started his pro career at HW before bulking up through dubious means, he would have lost to bigger heavies early on. His sytle was so much based on physical toughness and wearing down opponents, if had tried that in the HW division with his natural body after turning pro, he would have gone nowhere.

 

All that proves is that Holy's chin was better than Lewis', although given that a fighters chin seems to be the most significant factor by which you rank a fighter, your underrating of Lewis isn't exactly a surprise.

Lewis never had a stellar chin, but he was never outboxed by the likes of Ruiz and Moorer. Those losses hurt Evander's ranking far more than a couple of KO losses that were subsequently, and conclusively, avenged. I'm glad to see the majority of people on here can see that.

 

Top 20 definatlely

 

Totally agreed. I would add that dominance in wins should count as well. Lewis annihilated some fighters Ruddock or Golota that Holy would struggle against and easily controlled someone like Tua. Holyfield rarely knocked out someone in shape, interestingly Tyson was the only elite fighter who shoed up in shape that Holyfield knocked out at HW.

 

As a H/W... has to be 5.

When considering his losses, come backs, wins, longevity, opponents etc.. I doubt he would have been bettered by too many in the past, without avenging that loss.

Behind Ali.. Louis.. Where is he placed??? Far too active for Marciano... and stronger and more absorbant.

Through activity during a fight, a great match would have been Frazier. A punishing fight IMO..

Styles make matches. A youger Tyson would have been a more exciting fight, rather than the messed up Tyson of the '90's.

Hard to imagine many H/Ws being able to content with Holy, especially those not sharing his same tenacity.

 

bump.More lists guys.

 

Let me just bump this,good stuff.

 

1 Ali
2 Louis
3 Holmes
4 Johnson
5 Lewis
6 Frazier
7 Marciano
8 Foreman
9 Dempsey
10 Holyfield
11 Liston
12 Tyson
13 Harry Wills
14 Ezzard Charles
15 Jersey Joe Walcott