Pavlik is following Taylors footsteps: fighting bums and smaller guys

Spunik · Feb 23, 2009

I'd like to see him fight the winner of Winky/Williams fight (and assuming a win) then fight A.A.

sdsfinest22 · Feb 23, 2009

BigBone said: ↑

First of all, I like Kelly Pavlik and full credit to his fighting style and fans, hes exciting, has a loyal following and hes the deserving MW champion. At least was deserving up to one point. But his recent run and the future plans are damn disappointing. Is he following Jermain Taylors footsteps, who fought debatable competition and fighters from lower divisions?

Pavlik since the 2nd, very close, debated by some, Taylor fight:
-Gary Lockett: very soft fighter, undeserved mandatory, total mismatch. Still a mandatory, so we accepted it
-Bernard Hopkins at 170: Pavlik heavily favored, and turned to be a total mismatch, just the other way around, serious schooling, embarrassing loss, although health issues
-MARubio: another mandatory, another mismatch vs. a former 154-er. For the last time, we accepted it, but just because it was another mandatory, and a good victory for Kelly before his great crowds

And whats coming up, according to Arum?
-John Duddy: total mismatch. Very hyped fighter who happens to be significantly weaker in every area than Pavlik, it should be a Cotto-Gomez type of brutal, bloody beatdown
-Sergio Mora: what a joke. He had one decent night at 154 vs. over the hill, unmotivated Forrest, but lost the rematch which was almost a shutout. A 154 fighter with no power and any kind of advantage over Pavlik. Tayloresque opponent choice
-Vernon Forrest: even more Tayloresque: dont pick a MW bum, but a 'name' at a style, size, power disadvantage from a lower weight class. 38 years old Forrest, a former WW stopped by Mayorga, is clearly past it. Old WW Ike Quartey with a decent jab soundly beat him in a controversial fight, and no matter of his form, theres no loss more embarrassing than his vs. Mora. He offers no danger to Pavlik

We simply refuse to accept another mismatch. Lockett - Hopkins schooling - Rubio - Mora/Duddy/Forrest is a very unimpressive run for an undisputed champion, and it's not a division's fault. Pavliks legitimate NO1 status is in serious trouble. Not me, but many experts and fans debate that, a few now rank Abraham ahead of him (I disagree with that). While Kelly lost his fight moving up, Abraham stayed unbeaten in his non-MW contest, and beat Miranda much easier than Kelly did. He did it on Showtime, in Mirandas backyard in the States, showing and in a press release recently stating hes ready to fight in Youngstown, and his only wish and only reason to stay at MW is Kelly Pavlik.

This fight can be clearly made, and with German money involved, it offers a bigger purse for Kelly than these smaller guys. Not only us, boxing fans, but Pavlik himself and his fans deserve better than fighting guys absolutely out of his league. KP-AA would pack the Youngtown arena again, and Im sure Abraham made a fan or two in his US fight anyway, so this fight can pack the house.

This content is protected

Now quit making excuses and Bob Arum, if you read this, with all due respect, quit making these pointless mismatches. We are not stupid, and those who turn on the TV not for certain fighters, just for sports entertainment, will walk away from boxing if you keep feeding them with uneventful, one-sided beatdowns. With Team Pavlik being so confident of beating Abraham, theres no reason not to take the fight. King Arthur would move up to 168 anyway, so the very next fight would be a title fight for Kelly, win or lose. Im not saying who would beat who.

Lets not get into who would beat who. Let the fight decide that one! HBO is interested in the superfight, American fans demand is as much as any other region, just look at any poll or wish list, it offers (and only this fight offers) historical significance in the current MW division as a fight between clear no1 and no2, and both happen to be huge knockout artists. What more could you ask?

So cut the crap, and bring it on. We, the fans refuse to accept another mismatch, and in the end (at the end of the day ), we have to blame the fighter, who has little to do with selecting opponents. But Kelly is still fighting guys absolutely out of his league, and that combined with the recent loss, makes Pavlik, a nice guy, a furious fighter and a fan favorite look pretty bad.
Click to expand...

I'd say he has fought good competition...Cant knock anyone for fighting mandatory fights...BHOP was the best out there for him after Taylor...He got schooled but you can't knock him for not taking the fight...With that said I wish he would fight AA or Sturm!!

rabid dog · Feb 23, 2009

Taylor fighting bums? Winky/Lacy/Hopkins/Ouma..........
Are they all bums??:huh

Ivo · Feb 23, 2009

iceman71 said: ↑

and hopkins did the same thing
trididad, dlh, winky wright, carl daniels, simon brown
Click to expand...

The whole Hopkins record is build on lower weight fighters. Only in the Tarver case he was going up but it was at a perfect moment - after Tarver had to bulk up to 200 lbs in order to shoot the Rocky movie. So Tarver had to strugle to get back to 175 lbs limit.

BigBone · Feb 24, 2009

That's the best excuse a boxer ever had.

"I was shooting a Rocky movie."

See Me Flow · Feb 24, 2009

BigBone said: ↑

First of all, I like Kelly Pavlik and full credit to his fighting style and fans, hes exciting, has a loyal following and hes the deserving MW champion. At least was deserving up to one point. But his recent run and the future plans are damn disappointing. Is he following Jermain Taylors footsteps, who fought debatable competition and fighters from lower divisions?

Pavlik since the 2nd, very close, debated by some, Taylor fight:
-Gary Lockett: very soft fighter, undeserved mandatory, total mismatch. Still a mandatory, so we accepted it
-Bernard Hopkins at 170: Pavlik heavily favored, and turned to be a total mismatch, just the other way around, serious schooling, embarrassing loss, although health issues
-MARubio: another mandatory, another mismatch vs. a former 154-er. For the last time, we accepted it, but just because it was another mandatory, and a good victory for Kelly before his great crowds

And whats coming up, according to Arum?
-John Duddy: total mismatch. Very hyped fighter who happens to be significantly weaker in every area than Pavlik, it should be a Cotto-Gomez type of brutal, bloody beatdown
-Sergio Mora: what a joke. He had one decent night at 154 vs. over the hill, unmotivated Forrest, but lost the rematch which was almost a shutout. A 154 fighter with no power and any kind of advantage over Pavlik. Tayloresque opponent choice
-Vernon Forrest: even more Tayloresque: dont pick a MW bum, but a 'name' at a style, size, power disadvantage from a lower weight class. 38 years old Forrest, a former WW stopped by Mayorga, is clearly past it. Old WW Ike Quartey with a decent jab soundly beat him in a controversial fight, and no matter of his form, theres no loss more embarrassing than his vs. Mora. He offers no danger to Pavlik

We simply refuse to accept another mismatch. Lockett - Hopkins schooling - Rubio - Mora/Duddy/Forrest is a very unimpressive run for an undisputed champion, and it's not a division's fault. Pavliks legitimate NO1 status is in serious trouble. Not me, but many experts and fans debate that, a few now rank Abraham ahead of him (I disagree with that). While Kelly lost his fight moving up, Abraham stayed unbeaten in his non-MW contest, and beat Miranda much easier than Kelly did. He did it on Showtime, in Mirandas backyard in the States, showing and in a press release recently stating hes ready to fight in Youngstown, and his only wish and only reason to stay at MW is Kelly Pavlik.

This fight can be clearly made, and with German money involved, it offers a bigger purse for Kelly than these smaller guys. Not only us, boxing fans, but Pavlik himself and his fans deserve better than fighting guys absolutely out of his league. KP-AA would pack the Youngtown arena again, and Im sure Abraham made a fan or two in his US fight anyway, so this fight can pack the house.

This content is protected

Now quit making excuses and Bob Arum, if you read this, with all due respect, quit making these pointless mismatches. We are not stupid, and those who turn on the TV not for certain fighters, just for sports entertainment, will walk away from boxing if you keep feeding them with uneventful, one-sided beatdowns. With Team Pavlik being so confident of beating Abraham, theres no reason not to take the fight. King Arthur would move up to 168 anyway, so the very next fight would be a title fight for Kelly, win or lose. Im not saying who would beat who.

Lets not get into who would beat who. Let the fight decide that one! HBO is interested in the superfight, American fans demand is as much as any other region, just look at any poll or wish list, it offers (and only this fight offers) historical significance in the current MW division as a fight between clear no1 and no2, and both happen to be huge knockout artists. What more could you ask?

So cut the crap, and bring it on. We, the fans refuse to accept another mismatch, and in the end (at the end of the day ), we have to blame the fighter, who has little to do with selecting opponents. But Kelly is still fighting guys absolutely out of his league, and that combined with the recent loss, makes Pavlik, a nice guy, a furious fighter and a fan favorite look pretty bad.
Click to expand...

Good thread. :good Pavlik vs Abraham is the most logical fight for Pavlik, Abraham and boxing fans. No excuses from either fighter. This fight must take place within the next five months.

Ivo · Feb 24, 2009

BigBone said: ↑

That's the best excuse a boxer ever had.

"I was shooting a Rocky movie."
Click to expand...

So it is a piece of cake to go down in weight from 200 to 175 for a short period of time?

BigBone · Feb 24, 2009

Ivo said: ↑

So it is a piece of cake to go down in weight from 200 to 175 for a short period of time?
Click to expand...

Who the **** cares what Tarver does outside of the ring? 25 pounds is a peace of cake for Hatton, so I guess it shouldn't be a problem for Tarver, who's about 200 pounds in between fights, after a fat meal anyway.

Rocky Balboa is a movie, dude. It's not real.

Ivo · Feb 24, 2009

That's the excuse RJJ made after his lackluster performance against Tarver. He said he had trouble going down in weight. So if you are right about Tarver, then RJJ is full of crap. You cannot have it both ways.

I guess it is hard for you to understand that there is a difference between 25 lbs of fats - the Hatton case and 25 lbs of muscle - the Tarver and RJJ cases. It is harder to shed that much muscles for a short period of time without any side effects. We are not talking about Vargas on tortillas, OK? This is about muscles.

Back to the point, Hopkins had the advantage in that area when he fought Tarver. In all other cases Hopkins was fighting lower weight guys like DLH, Trinidad, Wright, Pavlik. His record is build on fighting smaller guys. So I have no problem with Pavlik fighting Forrest or someone else of that caliber.

BigBone · Feb 24, 2009

What part of Rocky Balboa is a movie you don't understand? He didn't prepare to fight Sly Stallone. He played Mason Dixxon, a non existing, fictive character. He had scenes of training, but it's just acting. He's about 185-190 during fights, easlily about 195-200 after a good restaurant visit between fights. Haye looked 240 in between Maccarinelli and Barrett (actually preparing to HW debut, not acting in a Hollywood studio under lights), yet he weighed in at 215, which is exactly 25 pounds. Of course he looked very muscular as he didn't do proper running, cardio excercises and sparring/gym excercises to lose body fat and muscle weight which happens in camp. The only difficulty Tarver had was Bernard Hopkins, who schooled him. End of story.

Ivo · Feb 24, 2009

I guess you are not reading what I have written. Yes, my English is not that good but I guess it is not that hard to understand what I mean. Hopkins picked the perfect moment to fight Tarver. Tarver was bulking up in weight in order to act as heavyweight. It would have been shameful to look worse than Sly. Even you said he did not do any real boxing training. He was just building up muscles.

Haye and Taver are like earth and sky body structurewise so that comparing them is senseless. By the way, Haye has never been 240 lbs.

ashley · Feb 24, 2009

We all want to see Pav VS AA but while we wait for that fight why not Pav VS Mundine?

Mundine is hard to catch and has good hand speed and evasion skills....and he can run quite fast in the ring.

Good 12 rounds for Pav to hone his skills for the big fight VS AA.

This fight makes great $ as well because Mundine has a great following in AUST....love him or hate him style...but Pav could take 100% of the gate and PPV and leave Mundine with his own sponsors and aussie PPV.

In then end I dont think Mundine can win but should go the distance and may even take some rounds off PAV.....I dont see it as a missmatch but a solid hitout with the risk of a closer fight if Pav is off his game.

Mundine will move, counter and run so it wont be an easy day at work for Pav however he should win by 116 - 112

Thoughts

PH|LLA · Feb 24, 2009

this thread is complete and absolute garbage. He fought Miranda, Taylor twice (once at 164), and Hopkins at 170, and this guy says "fighting bums and smaller guys"

WTF, ******ed

ashley · Feb 24, 2009

PH|LLA said: ↑

this thread is complete and absolute garbage. He fought Miranda, Taylor twice (once at 164), and Hopkins at 170, and this guy says "fighting bums and smaller guys"

WTF, ******ed
Click to expand...

Thread ending post :deal :yep

debaser · Feb 25, 2009

At 6'3 it's gonna be pretty difficult to find a guy that's taller than him between 160 and 175.

Log in or Sign up

Pavlik is following Taylors footsteps: fighting bums and smaller guys

Spunik Well-Known Member Full Member

sdsfinest22 Pound 4 Pound Full Member

rabid dog Active Member Full Member

Ivo Boxing Addict Full Member

BigBone Boxing Addict Full Member

See Me Flow The Pharaoh of Boxing Full Member

Ivo Boxing Addict Full Member

BigBone Boxing Addict Full Member

Ivo Boxing Addict Full Member

BigBone Boxing Addict Full Member

Ivo Boxing Addict Full Member

ashley Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

PH|LLA VIP Member Full Member

ashley Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

debaser Active Member Full Member

Log in or Sign up

Forums

Pavlik is following Taylors footsteps: fighting bums and smaller guys

Spunik Well-Known Member Full Member

sdsfinest22 Pound 4 Pound Full Member

rabid dog Active Member Full Member

Ivo Boxing Addict Full Member

BigBone Boxing Addict Full Member

See Me Flow The Pharaoh of Boxing Full Member

Ivo Boxing Addict Full Member

BigBone Boxing Addict Full Member

Ivo Boxing Addict Full Member

BigBone Boxing Addict Full Member

Ivo Boxing Addict Full Member

ashley Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

PH|LLA VIP Member Full Member

ashley Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

debaser Active Member Full Member

Pavlik is following Taylors footsteps: fighting bums and smaller guys