....and would Toney still be considered one of RJJ's greatest wins if Toney had the losses on his record? Obviously anyone who has seen the Toney-Tiberi fight know Toney lost...so thats one loss he should have had. McCallum I - Such a great close fight, could have gone to either fighter, personally had Mike edging it McCallum II - I thought Mike won this one aswell, more clearly then the first fight. Also 3 other Toney fights that I haven't seen, hopefully people on this forum have.... Toney-Williams I: D Toney-Sosa: SD Toney Toney-Johnson: SD Toney Any of these 3 fights gifts for Toney? So IMO he should have been 42-3-1 by the time he faced RJJ, the 3 fights I listed I have no idea what happened, but he certainly wouldn't have been one of the top p4p fighters with those losses on his record...
:huh I think I already said it, what fights do people think Toney lost before he met RJJ? and if those losses were given would it have been such a great win for RJJ
I never liked to say that a fighter won a fight if he really lost on the scorecards. Tiberi fought a depleted Toney. What happened to Tiberi? If he was good he would have won a title later. Toney was and is a HOF fighter.
Beat Johnson and McCallum in the first fight. Lost to McCallum in the rematch by the narrowest of margins. Lost to Tiberi.
Only Johnson and Tiberi may have a case of being jobbed. Johnson had that knockdown and was really quick and slick in his prime. Tiberi isnt near the level of fighter that Toney is but James just didnt do a whole lot in that fight. I thought he beat Mcallum first time he landed the cleaner harder blows all night, a draw was generous to Mike imo.
i had mccallum winning both fights...but the 1st fight could have gone either way...i remember that round 5 or 6 was the decider on that one
No, the only fight you mentioned where Toney didn't deserve the win was when he fought Dave Tiberi. Remember Toney was on the flu that fight, he had cramps and couldn't even walk properly in the late rds - hardly enough to question his P4P status at that time. And if you rewatch that fight attentively you'll see that it was still pretty close, it's not the robbery of the ages as some here claim. The first two McCallum fights were dam close, but Toney edged them both by 1-2 rounds in my book. And both times Toney finished stronger than MCallum, so these are deserved wins for Toney. Reggie Johnson gave Toney one of his toughest fights and knocked him down in the process. It was another close fight where Toney took over in the middle rounds and finished stronger, another deserved win for Toney. The Sosa fight was a clear win for Toney. I've never seen the Williams fight, but Toney admitted himself that Sanderline Williams gave him a great fight, so the draw is probably correct. Toney ouclassed him in the rematch btw. BTW, you being a Haye fan makes your questioning of James Toneys record somewhat uncredible. Especially since you do it in such a cheap way: you're obviously not an expert on Toney as you haven't even seen his fights against Sosa or Johnson, but you still raise speculations on them being gifts... hence your thread cannot be taken seriously.
What is the purpose of this thread? Toney lost to Tiberi. The Reggie Johnson and 2 McCAllum weren't robberies, just close fights. Personally, I thought that Toney deserved to win those 3 in close but clear cut fashion.He landed the heavier punches and was the aggressor.I do not understand how anyone can give the first MCcAllum fight to Mike. Toney also had close fights with Griffin (Twice), Sam Peter, Drake Thadzi which also could have gone Toney's way. So you see, Toney also lost his fair share of close fights. Toney's style just makes for close fights.
That's really a lame cop out. If you think that Toney won then so be it but it sounds here like you are insinuating that it was o.k. for Tiberi to get robbed simply because of what Toney went on to accomplish. You work your ass off and train, you deserve the recognition even if it's just for that one fight.
It is not OK. But let's remember 2 things: Toney offered Tiberi a title fight in Tiberi's hometown when he did not have to as Tiberi ws not mandatory. Toney offered Tiberi a rematch which Tiberi declined. Toney gor robbed equally or even worse in the Griffin rematch.
