I don't necessarily think that its a forgone conclusion. Liston was not much bigger than Marciano. In fact he was about the same weight as Joe Walcott, only a tad shorter. Sonny had maybe an inch or two in height on the rock. Admitadely, he would have had a 25 Lb or so weight advantage. Jack Dempsey always said that the first person who stands up to Liston will beat him, and as it turned out, the first person who stood up to him did. Granted, Clay had nothing in common with the Rock, but when Dempsey made his observation, I don't think he anticipated that a young kid who boxed like a heavyweight version of Ray Robinson was going to be the man to do it. I think he meant whoever had the heart, guts, work eithic, etc. There are few who top Rocky in these respects, and even fewer who have proven themselves in the types of wars that he did.... Liston might very well have beaten Marciano, but I refuse to rule it as a given, and I have serious doubts about it being an easy nights work. If the Rock survived an early onslaught and a few knockdowns to get back on his feet and some shots off, Sonny may well have a problem on his hands.......
To say that liston would have destroyed marciano is not to say that i don't respect rocky and that he was not one of the greatest of all-time (even though I feel he was a bit overated). He certainly overcame some big limitations to accomplish what he did. However, styles do make fights and rocky was made to order for liston. Also, i think you're a little off about the physical disparities. I believe Liston was actually taller than walcott (6"1 to 6"0) which would make him about 3 inches taller than marciano) and he was closer to 35 pounds heavier than rock, not to mention that he was tremendously strong. marciano going up against liston would be like a mini-van going head to head with a truck, and thats the only way he could fight liston. Sonny would take him out early and even if rock managed to last a few rounds he would be busted up.
Where did you get your facts from, mr. magoo? Liston was taller than Walcott. Liston's best fighting weight was just over 210 pounds. Walcott never weigh over 200 in a single bout. Liston had more than a 2 inch height advantage and a ridiculous 15 or so inch reach advantage over the Rock. I don't think it would be a close fight. l think a more fair matchup would be Marciano vs. Patterson.
I would'nt go as far as to say that, however he was a very competent boxer who could also bang with the best of them. He also had a top-notch chin, and these factors are what made him so dangerous and one of the greatest heavys of all-time.
Liston in his prime and around the time he beat Patterson, according to boxrec was 6'0" 1/2, and weighed around 215. Marciano at his best was 5'10", 185. Therefore, I suppose the difference fell smack dab in the middle of both of our figures. Liston's style definately projected problems for Marciano as you mentioned. I will repeat however that it is not my position that Sonny couldn't beat Rocky, but rather that a guaranteed victory is not in the bag. There are other things to take into consideration here, such as the fact that Marciano was arguably more durable, harder hitting, and was a better pressure fighter than anyone Liston ever faced. Some similar claims can be made in reciprocity, only Marciano never folded in the heat of adversity whereas Liston did.. It is not reasonable to assume that Liston would just maul any man who took the fight to him, because the fact is, no one ever did. It should be duely noted that Rocky Marciano was never beaten and still holds claim to the highest KO percentage of any heavyweight champion in the sport's history. Its possible that he is statistically the best heavyweight champion of all time. I realize he was not the greatest, and stats don't mean everything. They should not be ignored however. Some might take the easy way out of this and say " he fought old men, " or " he beat on blown up light heavyweights. " While these claims may be true to some extent, is best wins came against men who make no mistake about it, were still the very best in the division, and Liston didn't exactly reign during the golden age of heavyweight boxing either.
Marciano was not harder hitting than Liston ... in addition , while offering measurements , how's an 81" reach v.s. a 69" one ?
Well I think the thread is supposed to be about Liston v Baer,so on that I go for Liston ,better boxer, as durable,comparable power,his jab wins it by dec. Liston v Marciano? Many beleive one of Marciano's best performances was against Louis [I dont],loooking at that fight Louis with only the remnants of his abilities threw a few left hooks ,but his right never left his side,he badly marked up the incoming Marciano with just his jab ,a jab that was somewhat eroded by time and slower reflexes.Liston had a pile driver of a jab,what would that do to Marciano's face,[allways susceptible to cuts] ?I think Liston tkos Marciano after dropping him a couple of times. Any one coming in to Liston helps him because Listons weakness was his slow feet and inability to cut off the ring ,he followed you around,unlike his successor Foreman who had excellent geometrical skills in the ring ,and quickly took two steps laterally to have his target back in range.Sonny stops Marciano imo.
Janitor beat me to it. When I first saw this thread my mind automatically turned to the 1st Liston vs Cleveland Williams fight. A primed and motivated Baer would have put in a similar show and would have gone out the same. Well, about the same! Note: Williams really did put in a hearty and creditable performance in that one, don't you think? And it made for a very thrilling fight.
Points well taken. However, if archie moore and jersey joe walcott knocked marciano down then I could easily envision liston doing it. Sonny was a big heavyweight in his day and if and when he decked marciano he would be more hurt. Also take into consideration that rocks huge heart would make him fire right back at liston, leaving him open for more. And there's only but so much that any heavyweight could take from liston.