The current UFC HW division is so weak i got to thinking..... Could ANY of them beat Machida, Silva or Rampage? How do you think those big guys would handle these devastating big guys?
lol, just Brock Lesnar or Carwin would beat them, rather easily...He would just outstrenght and outweight them so easily. I don't see any of them, knocking Lesnar out with one punch..Lesnar would all put them on their back, yes even Machida. The difference of strenght and size would be too much in the end. Not because you are able to defend Tito's takedown(with a bad back) that you will be able to defend Lesnar's takedown..
Rampage theyll beat for sure. Machida will be the hardest because the guy is strong, I mean he threw Thiago like he was paper. He is also very hard to find. I dont think you can just shoot at Lyoto and expect a takedown
I'd take Lesnar over Rampage, not so sure how he'd do vs Silva (depends if he secures a takedown). Machida is damn near unbeatable. I don't think Brock could take him down, I maean ever since he entered MMA he hasn't looked half as quick and explosive as he was in the WWE. Course his moveset is much more limited in MMA but it's gotta do something with the absence of roids. I mean in WWE the mutha****a was flying in the ring with his speed, compared to what we see now it's like the dude's got sandbags around his legs
Let's see Silva at HW just once, and pit him against someone like Herring. If he survives, feed him to Nog. Personally, I'd want to see him fight Cung Le before he retires.
The Heavies are too big, even for Machida. None of them look like they have the frames to go to Heavyweight, not when the top dogs now weight well up towards 265 (of course with the exception of Fedor, but he is special)
The good HW don't need the UFC because they can make a pay day with different organizations. I recon a few of the LHW could beat most of the HW's
I beg to differ. I defy you to mention one name in the lhw division...One guy , who's got the equivalent of Barnett's overall skills. Go ahead... Machida ? What would machida do against a guy of Barnett's size ? How would Machida outwrestle a guy as skilled as Barnett ? NO ONE in today's LHW division is Barnett's equivalent. And that's JUST Josh Barnett... Submissions ? Wrestling ? P4P Barnett owns them all in that department. Anderson Silva's subs aren't superior...and his wrestling certainly isn't The only legit advantage you could give to fighters such as Anderson ,Machida , Jardine , Jackson , Rogerio etc...are in the striking department. ( could be argued for guys like rogerio & sobral ) Having said that , Barnett is also quite comfortable with his striking too. Sure , he's no mayweather or aerts...But knows enough to avoid the ko. He was once brutally koed by Rizzo and that's it. (years ago) Now that we have that out of the way... Let's take another example... (btw, i'm not even gonna bother with fedor) But let's take the ultra-one dimensional case....Mr Lesnar. No subs...no striking skills...legit greco-roman wrestling skills... That alone , + his athleticism + his SHW size + his raw power...that alone , draws the line between the lhws and the hws. skilled lhws could probably take out a few hws, but stop fooling yourself. the HW division is a paradox. We can easily criticise and yet...that division also happen to have some of the very best in the sport too. Can you name 1 guy who's got the jiujitsu credentials of the hw fabricio Werdum ? The only one i can personally think of is retired (Ricardo Arona who's an ADCC legend )... but how about the rest of the LHWs ? The negative thing i can say about the hw division is that it's a very..."divided" weight class. (too many fighters are not signed under the same organisation) , that is the hw division's biggest problem today. But the talent is there... hws are just as legit as any other divisions. Can you just imagine for a second...A guy of Aleksander's size...Or Junior Silva's size bull rushing a guy of Rashad's size ? Keep in mind , he'd be confronted to fighters who ALSO know their sub offense & defense ...and their wrestling..not to mention....guys like this all have dangerous ko power. There's nothing in today's lhw division that can't be seen in the hw class. (or MW division for that matter). Machida is great at what he does but let's not get carried away please. Have you seen him against a HW ? Go on youtube & watch his fight against a past prime "sam greco" , look it up. Keep in mind , Greco was just a mere kickboxer. and yet , he had no problem taking machida on the ground & dominating him there. (though machida still won a split decision). And that was a against a clueless , one dimensional striker...Not a specimen like Shane Carwin nor Junior dos Santos...Or Kharitonov... Seriously man.... Look , i'm not saying that the LHWs would be totally helpless. But enough is enough...i'm tried of reading the same **** over and over again. "the hw division is so weak"...argh...**** it. Some of the most complete fighters happen to fight in the hw divison. And yes there's also one dimensional ones...and average ones too...but i don't buy this automatic "superiority" label that other divisions are supposed to have. It's ridiculous. Sure there's cans...but like in all other weight classes.
Riiiiight....And a ****ing one dimensional kickboxer can ? (watch his fight against sam greco)... You're telling me that a guy of lesnar's size...and greco wrestling credentials would be helpless against a guy of machida's size ? Sure , Machida is more skilled , but his best chance would be to either land a quick KO in the opening round or to submit him asap. (before getting mauled and overwhelmed by the guy's size )... Did you see what he did to a guy of herring's size ? And tht's just Lesnar ! Not a multi-dimensional fedor ...
If Fedor can beat up inferior much larger fighters, Machida and Silva can do the same. Anderson and Fedor weigh the same, and no matter if Fedor is better, Silvas still the second best P4P. Barnetts a very good HW. But he's not in the UFC. The only UFC HWs that could give these two problems would be either Lesnar, Carwin or Gonzaga - and only because of their massive size and power. Of course these guys have got some great skills too, but P4P they fall far below Machida and Anderson. I dont know about that old wrestler your talking about, but im sure Machidas improved no end since then. In the UFC fighters get stood if theres no action on the ground so these guys couldnt just lay there slobbering and smothering them with their mass. I'd pick Anderson and Machida over ANY UFC Heavyweight.
Fedor is 230lbs ffs. The only way Machida or Silva are that weight is if they don't cut weight and therefore probably not train probably. Skills can trump weight up to a certain point but once past it, it's just not happening. This doesn't even apply to just HWs. I happened with BJ Penn and it would happen with GSP should he move up.
agree. this talk is a little crazy. sure they could beat some heavies but would simply be to small to compete with the top 5.
AGAIN...I beg to differ. For the argument's sake. Let's take the "big but one dimesional opponent" scenario. So according to your logic , BECAUSE fedor can do it , Machida & Silva can. 1 - Machida & Silva are both nowhere near fedor's level 2 - The logic of the big one dimensional opponent = easy kill , is partially flawed. Prime example of this... MACHIDA vs GRECO. Greco is a kickboxer. a HW yes , but a kickboxer. Not a ****ing jiujitsu master , not a sambo or judo artist...He gave mma a try once in 2001..twice in 2004 & twice in 2005...and that's it. Today , Machida is considered by many to be the perfect representation of a "top" lhw contender. (Which he is). & he still looked quite beatable against a mere kickboxer. Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira vs Sapp...(when sapp used to give a **** & Nog was still in his prime) , back in 2002. Sapp = as one dimensional as it gets. No striking technic , no submission technics. Not even legit wrestling credentials (At least Lesnar does). But is still a ****ing 360 lbs sized SHW who also happen to be ****ing strong as hell. We're not talking about a zulu type SHW here. The guy has a huge muscle mass. And as one dimensional as he was...He still gave Nogueira (nogueira who's one of the most accomplished in the history of the sport btw) , one hell of a fight. Tim Sylvia vs Monson. Here again , the scenario of the "big one dimensional" easy kill didn't work. and that was against Monson ! Not only a guy who's got superior wrestling but who also happens to be an adcc veteran. He could've subbed Sylvia at any moment..an easy rear naked choke and all would be over...But it didn't happened..why ? Because the other big guy knew how to take advantage of his huge size and imposed it on a more skilled guy. Let's even take a case in which he was beaten... Sylvia vs Couture... Again...Couture is a ufc living legend & a guy who's used to fight in both divisions (lhw & hw) a guy who's universally known amongst mma fans for his solid gameplans & wrestling.....Not only that , Couture used to train the big guy...They used to be sparring partners...you know what that means right ? That he had a lot of time studying his opponent. (and the opposite is also true But! big difference is...Couture is undeniably way more skilled). It took Randy 5 full rounds to finish a guy who's quite vulnerable on the ground. Fedor did it in a matter of seconds... The only other guys who came close were Arlovski & Mir ( in other words , OTHER HW FIGHTERS ) Guys who naturally fight in this weight class. There's certain stages of mediocrity... Obviously Tim Sylvia isn't ****ing Giant Silva (if you know what i mean). And when a guy is that big...No matter how "bad" he's supposed to be...He'll always have a major advantage. Especially in mma... (personally i think Mercer would kill him in boxing though...) But in mma , these big guys have all the advantages in the world. Another prime example... Machida vs Penn... That's right , i'm not gonna bother with the hw class here... Penn...who's naturally smaller had to work his ass off against Machida...Penn ! who's way more versatile ! (no offense to machida fans)... Even Penn had to face the music. (though frankly....Penn vs Machida was a bit like his fight vs Greco...far from being a satisfying victory.) Imagine what Penn would've done with machida's ass in the welterweight division. Now...Can you only imagine Machida , Anderson , Jardine , Jackson...confronted to a guy like Emelianenko (quick reminder...anything the likes of Penn , GSP , Faber , Yamamoto can do...Fedor can) In short...their best chance would be to land a quick KO in the first. Imagine the situation for a moment.. Anderson , Machida...Confronted to a guy who's undefeated since 2001...Who was confronted to top kickboxers , top bjj artists , top wrestlers , sambo & judo artists...The only guy who was able to pulverise one of the greatest mma fighter (nog) IN HIS PRIME. He was toying with him. A guy who recently finished two former ufc hw fighters (& champions) in less than 4 minutes COMBINED. I mean...do you even realise what we're talking about here ? Have you seen Anderson's latest fight against Patrick Cote ? Do you realise the difference ? Cote...who's not even a former champ , who's nowhere as big as the likes of arlovski or Tim...who's nowhere near as skilled as Arlovski... And you're posting a thread about Silva & Machida having a day in the park against the HWs ? Are you serious ? Granted...it is not statistically impossible that smaller opponents could wreck some HWs... but this talk about how inferior the hw division is needs to stop. Like i said earlier...yes , the hw division is plagued by separatism. You got some guys fighting over in japan (Overeem , Kharitonov & a few others)...Some fighting in america & europe...some fighting in the same country but not in the same org...that is true. But reunite them all under the same roof...and you have a legit "quality" division for sure. (and one of the most dangerous one too). All i'm saying...don't fool yourself into thinking that the likes of machida and co would steam roll everyone , cause that **** wouldn't happen. A victory here and there...sure...but no exaggerations please. the HW division as a whole is legit. Not perfect (no division is..) but legit.
