A Discplined Riddick Bowe...

Yes Futch didnt mess with anyone who wasnt worth it, thats why he kept giving Bowe so many chances. Going back to the Golota fights, I think it was evident as early as the second Holyfield fight that Riddick was on the decline. His weight gains and sloppy inconsistent performances had Futch constantly threatening not to return to Bowes corner. If you can appreciate all aspects of a complete fighter, it was quite obvious Bowe had all the physical tools to be something special, and thats why Futch believed Bowe had more talent than anyone he had worked with.
I believe the purpose of this thread was peoples thoughts on how far the best version of Bowe could have gone in the division. While Ill agree he never lived up to all the hype, he had more talent in his pinky finger than Frank Bruno.

 

Yeah its kind of like Razor Ruddock getting knocked out by Lennox Lewis after getting knocked from pillar to post by Tyson in two consecutive fights and then never doing anything else in the division and retiring as more or less the guy who took Tysons best, and was knocked out by Lewis and Morrison before retiring. Takes a little shine off of that win as well doesnt it? Your selective recognition of fighters is almost comical. Gonzalez wasnt anything special, but Bowe ruined him like Tyson ruined Ruddock.

 

Yeah, that sounds about correct.

 

I don't buy this crap about Ruddock being ruined by Tyson nor Gonzalez being ruined by Bowe. Is this really an issue of my selective reasoning, or is it more of a matter of you needing an explanation to justify why other fighters looked better in dispatching common foes? Jorge Luis Gonzalez was a big man with decent ability, but he was nothing like Lennox Lews. Therefore, I'm not sure why you brought up the comparison to begin with. To recap, Lewis had a better jab, better footwork, slightly better defense, and greater punching power. Bowe may have had the better chin, but I say that with no real conviction, given that he never really tested his chin against the division's best punchers. Hell, Herbie Hide had him out on his feet, Holyfield decked him, and Golata battered him pillar to post. Lewis may have been Ko'd by McCall, but he also took big shots from Frank Bruno, Ray Mercer, Vitali Klitschko and a number of others.


Again, I'm not saying Bowe has no chance, but comparing their styles and track record, Lewis needs to be the favorite here.

P.S. I think its telling that Rock Newman went through such great lengths to keep Bowe and Lewis from getting in the same ring. Even to the extent of throwing a title in the garbage and passing up a payday that would have likely exceded $20,000,000, to instead fight Michael Dokes in New York city for the cost of a fart.

 

If you dont buy it thats fine. Thats your opinion. Given the fact that boxing is a sport where mental strength has such a significance, it is in fact a very real phenomana of the game. Many fighters have never recovered from beatings, and Im not comparing Gonzalez to Lennox Lewis, Im comparing Ruddocks accomplishments and Gonzalez's accomplishments after their severe beatings. It was clear both fighters were never the same. Gonzalez was Ko'd by guys with no power at all, after taking one of the most horrendous beatings Ive ever seen, and Bowe was not a small man.
As far as Bowe and Lewis, yes that fight should have happened, but do you really think Bowe told his greedy manager to avoid Lewis at all costs? Or do you think Newman wanted the path of least resistance for the most money with a possible Lewis fight down the line? Look how rich Frank Warren got with Joe Calzahge and Ricky Hatton...

 

I agree, but how do we know when and to whom this phenomena occurs? Men like Joe Walcott, Ezzard Charles, and many others took numerous beatings before reaching their optimal best. Are we to understand that they were both shot by the time they won the world titles? Now, I agree that there definately some men who have been ruined by a single performance. I personally think that Meldrick Taylor's career took a real plunge after his fight with Chavez, but I don't know if that's what happened to Ruddock and Gonzalez. I just don't think they were that good to begin with.

fair enough.

As far as Bowe and Lewis, yes that fight should have happened, but do you really think Bowe told his greedy manager to avoid Lewis at all costs? Or do you think Newman wanted the path of least resistance for the most money with a possible Lewis fight down the line? Look how rich Frank Warren got with Joe Calzahge and Ricky Hatton...

No, I do not think Bowe told his manager to avoid Lewis. I do however question weather or not his team wanted him in the same ring though. Frankly, I think the Ruddock fight scared some people, but who knows.


Anyway, I give Bowe a puncher's chance in this fight, but favor Lewis. I don't feel that this is an unreasonable position.

 

How do you know? You know in future fights, when they lose consistently or get knocked out by guys they would have never lost to in previous fights. Meldrick Taylor is definitely a good example, so is David Reid after the beating he took from Trinidad, Francisco Bojado after the James Leija fight, and now Jeff Lacey who has barely survived against journeymen fighters after his beating from Calzahge, just to name a few.

 

Lewis hit a lot harder than Bowe and had a better jab and was a better textbook boxer.
Yes of course Bowe struggled with Holyfield, he won the first one but took a lot of punishment in doing so and don't forget Holyfield beat him second time around because he elected to box, I didnt have it "razor close at all", close-ish yes but clear. Styles make fights, imo both Tyson and Lewis were too powerful for Bowe, his chin was good but it wasn't McCall or Mercer good and you could throw a grain of rice at him in a hurricane from twenty feet away and be sure it would hit him in the face.

 

I like that expression:good

 

I just made it up, if you want to use it, please send me a cheque for £5 and a chocolate bar of your choice

 

No problem, I might just have to do that,

 

This how a big man should fight against a guy who likes to box from the outside.

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjZXPl0JcFA[/url]

 

Was the olympic win that spectacular anyway? Bowe clearly wins the first round, not sure why the ref stopped it in the second, Bowe clearly raises his hands like hes ready to continue

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z7wFR8dJYg&feature=related[/url]

 

Again, it was a respectable performance by Bowe. But, this fight can hardly be used as an accurate berometer of how a Bowe vs Lewis match would play out. Gonzalez spent way too much time on the ropes, did not know how to tie Bowe up on the inside, and left himself wide open every time he threw a punch. His jab was also more of a sweeping or pawing type of punch rather than the textbook type that Lewis threw. Lastly, Lewis was superior to Gonzalez in both the speed and power department.

Here, look at what Lewis does to Michael Grant, who frankly I believe had more in common with Bowe than Lewis did with Gonzalez, and who was at least if nothing else, a better opponent.

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emfS1S2SXkI[/url]

 

Are you kidding?? Michael Grant started boxing ver late, had very few amatuer fights, and had no skills. Bowe was a seasoned amatuer fighter who went to the olympics. cmon!!!:huh