Ali's GREATNESS...truth, fiction or in between?

Imo it is not fictional the man ws truly one of the very finest ever, not out of place in the company of Greb, Langford, Duran, Robinson, Charles etc etc.

 

I think he's known as the greatest as much for what he did outside the ring as what he did in it - refusing to go to Vietnam, standing up for black civil rights, etc.

Is he the greatest heavyweight in history? Maybe. He's definitely up there, beating Foreman being his crowning acheivement in my opinion. That truly was an unbelievable performance.

What's your opinion?

 

For the general public, Ali of course wouldn't have been such a huge profile if not for his larger than life persona and everything that came with it. But for those really interested in boxing I think the hype surrrounding Ali just possibly makes it a bit hard at times to give him his full due.

The man beat some 30 plus fighters ranked in the top 10, including the likes of Liston, Patterson, Frazier and Foreman. Even after a long lay-off he emerged as the top guy in a very competitive era. Just look at how Dempsey and Tyson did under similar circumstances to see how hard that is.

So, there's no doubt in my mind that he has the wins to back up his legacy. But his legend tends to cloud the facts a bit at times, but not always to his benefit.

 

You actually think it's stretch to call Ali the greatest HW of all times? If so, I'd like to know why.

 

Ali's greatness stems from the condition he left his opponents in.

Frazier, Norton, Foreman Quarry, Patterson and Liston weren't the same fighters after facing Ali.

Ali's genius is knowing that he couldn't stand and trade with Foreman for more than three rounds while remembering how his two toughest oppoenents got knocked out inside two rounds. Ali once questioned Foreman's conditioning after both the Frazier and Norton fights noting that George was breathing very hard, just after two rounds.

 

Yep, let's be objective:

1. Ali won over 20 title fights and defeated more than 30 ranked opponents. Only Louis compares here. (Holmes didn't defeat as many ranked opponents).

2. He cleaned out three (albeit with some controversial calls) generations of top HWs. Only Louis possibly compares here.

3. He defeated three fighters that most have in their top 10, + one that many have in their top 20. No other HW even comes close here.

4. Ali's coming back to top a difficult division after a long lay-off is unprecedented in HW-history, perhaps in boxing history in general.

5. He never even came close to losing in his prime (ca 1964-1967/1965-1967). Not too many (if any) HW champs can claim that.


This makes it unreasonable to have him outside the top 2 IMO, and I actually think he's a pretty clear choice for nr. 1, even if I by no means think it's outageous to have Louis there. But I see it as close but clear in favour of Ali.

 

Ali was top 3 for me but Joe Louis was the greatest IMO

 

A definite lock for top 2 heavyweight imo. Him or Joe Louis its a pick em either way

 

He did nothing of the sort, the Nation of Islam were diametrically opposed to the civil rights movement, they had nothing to do with it whatsoever. They preached hatred of white people and violent retribution, hatred of black intergrationists and even according to Ali himself, put the feelers out for cooperation with the kkk as they had many of the same goals.

 

Truth, in my opinion. :good

 

It's possible without the personality and politics, that people would think he was EVEN GREATER than they already do, not less so. A humble champion with the type of resume he had - wow. How's that for a perspective? And, if he hadn't lost the three years due to Vietnam, he would have had even more defenses, and maybe he would not have lost it physically quite as much. His legs were never the same after that three years - it is like night and day. Of course, if Louis didn't have WWII, he'd have more defenses too - and he was clearly past it after WWII as well. But all this is speculation. Ali did what he did and was what he was. And he's got a lot of great names on that resume. Not sure too many heavys in history compare in terms of the breadth of quality top guys he fought.