A Discplined Riddick Bowe...

Thanks man. Yeah, my day would be a lot more productive at work if I hadn't wasted my time going in circles on this ****. Next time, I'm passing it off on to you to beat your head against the wall:good

 

Bowe would easily beat tyson, way too classy a fighter and tyson has problems with guys that size.

 

Thats not correct. They all are on the same par, based on their accomplishments. Fringe contenders with a few of them capturing meaningless titles. Is there really much difference between Zeljko Mavrovic and Larry Donald or Frans Botha and Buster Mathis Jr, or Bruce Seldon and Shannon Briggs? Golotas was best known for beating up a shot Riddick Bowe, nothing more. Punching threats dont always make it a more competitive or meaningful fight. There is a difference, between those guys and a guy like Mercer, or Bruno, Holyfield and Mcall based on their accomplishments, which in my opinion were Lewis' best opponents. You want to call Ruddock competitive with Tyson? With exception to having some moments where he landed a few punches, he basically got shut out in both fights, and to me was more impressive in the beating he took. The stoppage was premature in the first fight, but it was an inevitable ending at that point, Tyson had him almost defenseless on the ropes.
People tend to judge Bowe's entire career off of the fact he avoided Lewis and the Golota fights. Unlike Lewis who faced Golota in his prime Bowe faced him in his last fight, very similar to the situation of Lewis in the Klitschko fight. Up until the end of his career with exception to Lewis what other dangerous contender did he avoid? I think a rematch with Holyfield was more than justified, especially considering Lewis was hurt badly in his first defense, and knocked out in his third defense, after defending against Phil Jackson, who was about as big of a joke as Jesse Ferguson.

 

Tyson would never have been able to deal with that size.

 

Yes, there is. I totally agree while Bowe has the best win, Lewis best wins takes the next 5-10 places after that.

I'm actually so sick of this kind of **** I could puke. Bowe had just come off one of his best victories and no one, I repeat NO ONE, thought that Bowe was shot. He was seen as by far the most formidable threat for a comebacking Tyson.

If Bowe had looked good in the rematch I'd be fully prepared to put the first fight down to lack of preparation and overconfidence, but as it is it seems rather that Golota exposed him to a degree.

I truly hate this rewriting of history to come up with excuses. Liston was past it against Ali, despite coming off his best two wins. Hagler was shot against Leonard, two years after his best win with only one fight in between. Tyson was hopelessly depleted against Douglas, despit being 24 and 18 months from his best win. Etc, etc. This is such a load of crap.

Perhaps Bowe had passed his peak, but shot... That's not worth taking seriously.

 

That Golota was coming off a year of inactivity and damaged goods even before the Lewis fight?

Great win for Lennox, but have some perspective. It isn't as cut and dry as Lennox wiped his ass with Golota.

 

Cmon, he was dropped by Holyfield and out on his feet from a short little hook. It was common knowledge Bowe was spending his training camps killing himself to shed weight only. Its not excuses, its fact, and the fact that Bowe looked horrible in the first Golota fight, Futch left him for good in the second, and Bowe retired after the second fight, should tell you he was done.
Were not talking about Tyson, thats a different story, but yes, Tyson was depleted not because he was shot, but because his skills were eroding due to poor preparation and the replacement of a key player to his sucess in his corner. It showed in the Bruno fight, he swung wildly and was rocked badly by Bruno. Its like saying Lewis was the same fighter once he replaced Correa with Steward, thats simply not true. He improved tremendously.

 

What the hell do I have do, disect the careers of people like Bruce Seldon and Shanon Briggs, in an effort to convince you that Lewis fought better men? Sorry, I'm taking anymore time on this. You have youtube available at your disposal along with boxrec, various online boxing publications along with the testimonies of numerous, knowledgable posters here who can tell you who fought the better lot between Bowe and Lewis. Frankly, I think you're holding on to this issue for dear life for sake of some cause to avoid losing face, and I don't know why. If we're honest, 90% of this can be chalked up to common sense ( at least for those of us who have it ), while the rest is pure speculation and probably better left to the hoplessly bored and unemployed.

I will reiterate my position on the matter one last time before ducking out of here.

1. Lewis needs to be favored over Bowe in a head to head matchup, by virtue of his superior boxing ability and Bowe's tendency to absord too much punishment when facing a good technical boxer who can penetrate his poor defense.

2. Bowe at his absolute best has a puncher's chance at beating a pre-steward Lewis, but the od's are still not in his favor.

3. While Bowe's win over Evander Holyfield may justifiably be the single best claim that either man has, Lewis has far greater depth and arguably beat several men who are better than Bowe's #2 opponent.

That concludes my participation on the topic.

 

Your wrong, how could you say he only had a punchers chance based on the fact that Bowe had progressed quicker as a pro, was the undisputed champion beating a prime Evander Holyfield, and Lewis was knocked out by lessor competition pre and post Steward? Thats a ridiculous statement. Were debating that they fought relatively the same type of competition, throwing a prime all time great into the mix. Ive said that Lewis had a longer career and better career overall, but he never faced an all time great in their respective prime, and the fighters that he did fight that actually won titles and had solid pedigrees he lost against or struggled. Now if you think a guy like Golota, Mavrovic, Briggs or Akinwande, are solid fighters, I again ask you the question, what did they accomplish in the sport? Bruce Seldons title win against Tucker was about as impressive as Briggs' 12 round Ko over Lyhovich after losing every round. Besides that both guys were knocked out against any meaningful fighter they faced.

 

So he was dropped? He was almost dropped in the first fight, and then he didn't succeed in KO'ing Holyfield. He was 29, with jut one defeat and came from his second best victory. He was not shot. And there was nothing wrong with his shape in the rematch. Spinks quit after facing Tyson. Was he shot too?

This is BS, and I'm done with it. I have no time and little respect for people who try to rewrite history like this. I readily believe that Bowe was slack with his training, and, as I said, had he performed in the rematch I'd would be ready to put the first one down to lack of preparation. But he didn't. And he wasn't shot. Using that term here is robbing it of any significance.

 

Different fighters retire for different reasons. Spinks and Lewis went out before they were shot, Bowe, Tyson and Holyfield did not. In this case, Bowe was shot. It was evident in his reaction, timing, and mostly his speech. He was getting hurt badly in three consecutive fights usually a sign that something aint right anymore.
A fighter can lose his legs and ability to take a punch from gaining and shedding large amounts of weight between fights, and that was a known fact in the case of Bowe, after he won the title and what I believe ulitimately shortened his career. To me his last strong performance was in the Gonzalez fight, and even though he beat Holyfield in the third fight, he really never looked right.

 

How did Bowe progress quicker as a pro, because he had accumulated a larger number of fights earlier? Take a look at their competition. Lewis, with only 14 fights behind him, battled and defeated a 35-0 Gary Mason who both the ring magazine along with all three sanctioning bodies had in their top 10. Now, how many guys did Bowe fight like that to earn a world title shot? Especially with only 14 matches? Next you're going to tell me Mason was a bum with a padded record, but needless to say avoid mentioning that Bowe in his 15th pro bout took on some obscure nobody who was 8-7.

If you want to oversimplify the hell out of things, then sure we can just as easily say that Bowe beat a better opponent in Evander Holyfield and never lost to anyone as bad as McCall, then just call it a day. Well, history is not that simple. You may want to note that Lennox Lewis had a substantially longer reign than Riddick Bowe did, and not only did he fight an infinitely larger number of rated opponents, he is dangerously close to joining the fraternity of Muhammad Ali and Joe Louis in the category of most ranked opposition. In addition, Lewis rarely ducked challengers with the exception of Byrd and Ruiz. The only reason for this because nobody was willing to pay a bucket of warm spit to see either of those fights, so he fought MIke Tyson instead.

Bowe on the otherhand, avoided every Dick, Harry, and Tom that came up the pike and divided the world titles after two previous champions had managed to keep them together. Bowe struggled mightily with the much smaller and older Evander Holyfield, and was even beaten by him. He got his ASS HANDED TO HIM by Andrew ****ING Golata on no less than TWO occasions, who Lewis absolutely humiliated. Why don't you ever address that ****? And are you really serious when you say that Jorge Gonzalez, Bruce Seldon, Herbie Hide and Larry Donald are equal to Razor Ruddock, Vitali Klitschko, David Tua, Shannon Briggs and Michael Grant?!?!?!?!!?! Is this a joke???????



Dude seriously, if you're trying to establish any level of credibility here, then you really need to go back to the drawing board. You can start by scratching this topic and remember to do better in depth research the next time.

 

So it was Tom Dick and Harry he avoided? Its obvious you started watching boxing in the mid 90s when Lennox Lewis won the title. As far as me establishing a level of credibility here, I think I can more than hang, regardless of how much you think you know. You on the other hand are the ass clown who posted a picture of yourself in a skirt.

 

I second that. Everyone who's been following this thread sees that you're out in deep water trying to defend your favourite fighter (or one of them at least), and that will hurt your credibility on other subjects.

Yes, Bowe had lots of talent, but his record isn't in miles of Lewis's and he wasn't tested much (largely because he staid away from dangerous opponents), and one of those tests (Golota) he failed with miserably. You could possibly say his potential matched Lewis's, but comparing what they actually showed they could do... There it's not even close.

 

Gee now that's a real credible accusation coming from someone who claims equality between someone like David Tua and Bruce Seldon, and in all likelyhood never saw any of them fight.

Uh no. This contest has been a rather one sided affair as was our last discussion about Foreman's comback compared to Holmes'. Outside of a lot of repititious typing ( which shouldn't have been necessary ), it was like an easy tune-up for me.

Perhaps this was the picture you were illuding to

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You'll notice there are bagpipes in my hand and a medal around my neck. Learning to play a comprehensive musical instrument and do it competitively takes a reasonable amount of intelligence and dilligence. Two things that a ****** like yourself will never acquire

Fairwell :hi: