Pac and Henry Armstrong comparison.

You might be one of those cases where fighters of the old generation will always be better than the newer.

I am not claiming Pac has accomplished more than Armstrong, more likely Armstrong accomplishments supercede Pac but I think you are being bias. Personally I do not care which of the two has done more, although I dislike people worshipping past fighters as something that none during current time can be compared to.

I believe when looking at an athlete it should be taken in respective to their time period and among other competitors during their time. Today's athlete tend to be better equipped and would likely do better h2h if matched up, hence olympic records being broken often on things that can be measured. So how do you compare "Most of them are on the same level as the 3 Mexicans, guys like Ross, Ambers, Angott, and Arizmendi (at least) being clearly better in my view" quoted from you. The 3 mexicans are the best in their respective classes and their classes are stacked enough.

 

He's right though.

 

Let's take Armstrong's career and superimpose it over now.

He lost his pro debut by kayo. He lost three of his first four. He lost four of his first 16. He would have been written off very quickly.

But then a 21 fight unbeaten streak (4 draws) in and around LA would have generated a decent fan base. But losing 4 of his next 7 would cause him to be discarded again.

He went unbeaten in another 11 before back-to-back decision losses. It would have to be over at this point, right?

But then going 37-1 (31 KOs) and grabbing the featherweight crown in less than 2 years, fighting in LA, NYC, Buffalo, Detroit, New Orleans, Youngstown, etc., would put the boxing world in a frenzy. He would cause a media firestorm.

Is he fighting too much? Why aren't others fighting as often? Who is he fighting next? Why are you ducking Armstrong!

With his firepower and crowd-pleasing style, the promoters and networks would be lining up the armored cars filled with CA$H!

 

Have you seen their fights? I would put vic darchinian in the ring and vic would win among those boxers. You can't compare boxers of those era from today. Boxing had improve significantly. They have their own place in boxng history and boxers of today have their ow place as well

 

Vic Darchinian? A flyweight?

Against feathers like Petey Sarron, Benny Bass, Baby Arizmendi, Chalky Wright? Against lightweights like Lou Ambers, Lew Jenkins, Sammy Angott? Against welter Barney Ross?

Vic is a very good fighter, but he's not another Manny...

You obviously have zero understanding of the depth of talent that existed during those past eras.

 

Amstrong's name is set in stone. An immortal Legend. Pac aint on this guys level man, seriously.
Sorry Pacturds.

 

Pal, give it a rest it's bad enough with over the top Pacman huggers on here without the huggers of lesser fighters also being silly.

 

Henry Armstrong was undisputed in three traditional weight classes, never mind the fact that he held all three at the same time. He was a natural lightweight who made 20 welterweight title defenses in two years setting the division record. By most accounts, he should have been undisputed in four traditional weight classes.

Now you are either aware of this or you aren't, but to use weasel words such as "more likely" when comparing their accomplishments? There is nothing "more likely" about it.

 

Boxing is not like other sports where someone is competing mainly against the clock. The fighter is matched against the brain and heart of another fighter. Some things never change. Fighting is still fighting and tough is still tough.

And while some things do change, the basic rules have changed very little over the years. 3 minutes is still a round and ten seconds is still a knockout.

How many times have we seen the guy who seemed to have every advantage on paper lose to the "slow-crude-unathletic" guy? Too many to count...

The Ross comparison was unfair because he is proven P4P all-time and at another level. But IMO Ambers, Angott and Arizmendi could compete today against any and all comp out there, just as IMO MAB, JMM and Erick could compete aqainst any of the past.

With today's weigh-in rules, past welterweight champions would be fighting for 130, 135 or 140 titles. With the weigh-in rules of yesteryear, today's middleweights would have to fight at light heavy.

Many of today's "world class" fighters struggle to go 12 rounds. What would happen if they were put into a 15 or 25 rounder?

Kinda like Ricky Hatton?

They didn't have the luxury of 10-20 different angles and super-slo-mo from today's high-tech cameras.

 

How about Pac's flyweight title? Add this to his featherweight and lightweight titles and he had three titles in the original boxing divisions.

 

You seem to forget that in Armstrong's time most boxers only come from Great Britain and the USA unlike today that boxing is likely truly international...

 

No need to be a smartass. Pac's career is not over, a possible future Mayweather matchup would be his biggest fight if it takes place and who knows what else the future may hold. I am not much concern about comparing Pac to Armstrong, my argument is more on comparing a past fighter versus one of current in general.

Comparisons are very difficult when done with fighters from 2 eras, because alot of factors aren't the same. Let me give you some examples:

1. Fighters of current day are NOT allowed to hold and keep multiple weight class titles. Does this mean no one will ever has a chance to be as great as past fighters?

2. Fighters in the past do not cut weight as they do today, as you can tell by the average fighter build of the past compare to today. Today practically every boxer tries to cut down to their very peak weight to be most effective without facing bigger guys having the disadvantage.

3. Regarding accomplishments there are arguments for both sides. There are accomplishments current fighters can never achieve due to the changes to the sport, but same would go for vice versa.

4. Title defenses is great and all for showing how dominant you are at the weightclass. It solidify that you are the very best at that weightclass but some of them opponents can't be all that great, when you the few of the very top of that class over the course of some years it should be enough. Doing more just polish up your record and show a bit more verification.

5. Fighters in the past are not nearly as polished as they are today. But that does not take away props for Henry Armstrong because he would also be part of that batch and was the best of it. Although it does make comparing difficult, how do you figure who has the better opponents? Please do not tell me all the past fighters would beat the current crop because I am quite sure the majority wins would not favor past fighters in head to head matchups.

BTW I am nowhere close to 100 years old so I was not able to follow through with every event Armstrong was involved in. And if you watched videos then it also does not have the complete collection, therefore your assessment are pretty BS trying to pose as some great boxing guru unless you are older than crap. Don't go around reading articles, checking boxrec and come spouting off as if you had first hand experience seeing all these fights.

 

Sure enough if Pacquiao is fighting in county fairs in England!!!...

 

The way you tell it these guys you describe walk off the street, sign a contract and they're fighting a main event in MSG. Maybe in the movies; but in real life, they'd be in a four rounder, if they were lucky.

Promoters didn't have fat TV contracts. They needed to put asses in seats. One thing sells tickets and that's a matchup, then and now.

You think a fan was gonna shell out his hard earned cash during the Great Depression for anything that smelled like Tyson-McNeeley? Not likely.

Fans demanded competive matchups that promised action. A fighter might stink out the joint once or twice, but after that he'd find himself holding a one-way ticket back to the hobo jungles.

A guy gets a couple of one-round kayoes in a row and matchmakers would be upping his comp level real quick.

 

I said undisputed...