Ali-Frazier IV in December 1981-who wins?

I've never seen Frazier-Cummins but I have often heard that Joe got a gift draw.

I guess I can't really say then.

I have seen Ali-Berbick a handful of times and Ali had his moments of competence but nothing compared to any sort of his previous brilliance.

Ali was showing signs of damage, as mentioned, and I've heard that he had a hole in his brain as reported by the Mayo Clinic. Don King withheld this information to make this fight happen.

I just see it being ugly. Flat-out ugly. One of those fights the anti-boxing people will cite as a reason to ban boxing.

 

Ali looked like poop against Berbick, he only looks competent because people compare it to his ridiculously abysmal showing against Holmes. At least Frazier showed flashes of his former self against Cummings. The fact that Frazier could still show some offense would have offset anything Ali was marginally capable of doing in 1981. It never ceases to amaze me that Ali has such a hypnotic hold over his fans that some actually think he could have beaten ANYONE in 1981.

 

As much as I like Frazier and dislike Ali...I am glad this fight never happened! Frazier would be my pick....but who would care (it would be as significant as Nelson vs Fenech III)

 

I'm sure we are all glad that this fight never happened.

I believe that Ali would have beaten Frazier had they ever fought each other a fourth time in 1975-1978 but after the second Leon Spinks fight he began a rapid decline and really had nothing left for the Holmes and Berbick bouts.

Frazier was done as a contender after the Thrilla in Manila but he may have been able to win some type of a close decision against Ali in 1981. He was still willing to go forward and Ali would have had nothing to keep Frazier off of him. Probably would've turned out to be an ugly fight more so than a brutal one but it surely wouldn't have done any good for either of them.

 

The funeral director

 

In 1981, Muhammad Ali was still considered as a recent heavyweight champion, while Frazier hadn't fought much over the past 5 years. While Ali was certainly having health issues and was totally shot, his motor skills were still probably no worse at this point than Frazier's were. He had Just given peak versions of Berbick and Holmes 10 rounds a piece, while Joe had arguably lost to the journeyman cummings....

Ali decision 10..

 

But thsos ten rounds vs Holmes was a beat down. If Holmes relly went after Ali, he could have stop early imo.

 

Holmes did not look like he was taking it easy to me..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBa9BxfYpHA

 

Ali may have edged Frazier.But I'm going with a draw for the simple fact that Frazier would've been psyched for Ali.

 

Ali UD. this Ali was a lot slower, but he could still jab and dance a bit, just not for a while. I never saw Frazier-cummings. anyone wanna upload that fight?

 

I don't want to pick a winner in this particular hypothetical match, and wouldn't have even tried to bet on it, so I'll just say 10 round draw.

 

He was not taking it easy per say. But if Holmes went ALL OUT on Ali from the start(Dempsey Willard so to speak) I dont see that Ali making it out of round 2.

Holmes was just set on battling Ali with the jab and on the ropes.

 

I actually scored Ali the winner over Berbick, 97-93. I felt he controlled the movement within the ring (generalship), outscored Berbick handily from long range with his admittedly much diminished jab and right cross, largely neutralized Trevor's flailing at the body ineffective in the clinches, and defended against head shots well. Berbick did manage to connect solidly a few times, but Muhammad rode these episodes out with resilience. I thought Ali was better against Berbick than Page was six months later, and in fact Muhammad did finish closer than Greg in the scoring. (Ali was obviously far better against Berbick than John Tate had been.) After their match, Berbick did say Ali hit him harder than Holmes had. I believe Ali was still a top ten heavyweight, based on his performance in Nassau. Having said all that, I'm glad the judges voted as they did, as Muhammad might otherwise have continued at a time when he had no business competing.

Jumbo Cummings was not remotely in Berbick's class, and Frazier got a very generous draw at the end of ten. He was nearly 30 pounds over his best weight. Cummings was no defensive master, and Joe did land some good hooks, but to no great effect. This matters because Muhammad never lost his ability to take a punch.

Assuming they did square off in December 1981, I'm sure Ali would have managed a clear UD. He'd clinch in close and smother Joe's body attack, and box from long range, where Frazier's diminished vision would cost him. Ali came on against Berbick in the last few rounds, and Trevor normally had decent endurance. (In his next fight, he stopped Racette in 11.) Frazier may have been psyched for a fourth crack at Muhammad, but that wouldn't offset the mounting arthritis, impaired vision, high blood pressure and other physical ailments breaking his body down. His style of swarming was far less conducive to an extended career than Ali's style of boxing.

 

Ali UD.

 

I agree with this, but honestly, the way Ali's health was deteriorating, he surely couldnt help but get worse in his next fight. I dont mind too legends going at it, didnt even mind Fenech Nelson III but I am with the consensus, am very glad this one didnt happen.