Ali vs Wlad/Lewis/Vitali... how does he win?

These discussions are awesome.

Again, it has to be an Ali at his best to beat any of these guys.

Prime guys....Wlad because of his skills you mentioned plus sheer size can cause Ali all sorts of problems.

Carefull Ali beats him.

pridefull aggressive Ali might get his ass kicked.

 

the ali that beat lyle even KO's wlad, and that was ali not at his best.....

vitali may get to that version of ali

 

Is it a 12 round fight or a 15 round contest? If it's a 15 round fight Ali would use his superior stamina to win most of the championship rounds. Wlad has proven stamina issues, which he showcased against Brewster and Purrity. For a man 240-250 6'6 and half, you better believe he wont have the stamina of a prime Ali, who was 6'3 220.

I see Ali moving around the ring like a butterfly, catching Wlad and confusing him at certain points in the fight. All the chasing he's going to have to do to catch Ali will with punches, will wear him down by the 8th, and from then on Ali will start to have his way with him and eventually knocking a mentally beat Wlad down to the ground. similar to what he did to Foreman, but he would get caught with less punches seeing it's the 67 version of Ali, opposed to the 74 version that fought Foreman.

Wlad has been successful because the oppenents he has fought lately were content on staying on the outside winging punches. Like Chagaev, Iggy, Rahman, Brewster 2, Austin, were all stationary targets and they paid the price for it. Ali is the complete opposite of that, and will be 10 times harder to hit. Anybody that boxed will tell you, missing a punch takes more out of you than connecting.

 

YOU ARE WRONG.

Ali showed his physical peak in the 60's. We never got to see his prime.
What Ali did in the 70's illustrated his greatness, not his prime.

BTW-are you ****ing ******ed? Did you see the first Ali-Liston fight?
You wanna go on record here to say Liston threw the first fight? Cause he sure took an ass wuppin before he quit...thats for sure!

 

What a load of ****.

The better question is, how are the Klits going to handle someone who isn't an overweight slob that would be a club fighter in previous eras?

All this **** about Ali being so dominant because of his height advantage is horse****. His most impressive, and dominant performance was against a 6"6 belt holder, whose best punch was a jab. He struggled more with the smaller, brawling type of fighters that gave him no room, not the guys who gave him space to find range and use his elusiveness. And here is a newsflash for you: Ali's reach was remarkably long for his height. He was comfortably out-jabbing 84" reach Sonny Liston.

This "size is everything" mentality needs to stop. Sure, guys like Lewis and the Klits would be very competitive against Ali. They'd be a tough fight for anyone. But the Klits in particular would simply have no answer for the speed. And they sure as ****ing hell aint knocking him out. He's arguably the hardest heavyweight to stop in history, granite chin and amazing recuperative powers, not to mention elusiveness second to none.

Gameplan? Here it is: Ali would be moving in and out of range like he always did in the 60s. Landing jabs, and occasionally stringing combinations together. He'd force the others onto the front foot and counter them with his clear edge in speed and reflexes, not to mention stamina and workrate. How exactly do you propose they beat Ali? Everyone thought they had something over him, and would find a way to exploit a weakness, but once they got in front of him in the right, suddenly he seemed a whole lot faster and harder to catch.

 

shut the **** up idiot. Ali was already somewhat shot and Wlad would have murdered that version of Ali. ****in easy:-(

 

for being called the greatest of all time by most....one thing ali was underrated in was DEFENSE.......the guy had great defense.....watch the foreman fight, and dont tell me he didnt have great defense......

 

The same way it did against Ernie Terrell. Ali didn't even lose a minute of that fight, and whilst he was inferior to Wlad, the height principle you're proposing is rubbish.

And again... his reach was long for his height. And let's face it, he's not that small himself. Reach is far more important than height when fighting at a distance, and elusive footwork further negates size discrepancies.

 

I would also like to point out, Ali might not have a ton of power. Though his placement of punches were what made him special and gave him the opertunity to knock out good chinned oppenents, ATG's, and hall of famers. Guys like Frazier, Liston, Foreman, Moore, and others. Wlad has an extremely weak chin to begin with, so it wouldn't take much. A middleweight could of knocked out Wlad the night Brewster did. There's nothing worse than getting tired in a fight, you are wide open to shots you should be able to avoid and move out of the way of. Ali's dancing around the ring will eventually deplete all of Wlad's stamina, and you will see Wlad fade during the championship rounds. There are also disadvantages of being that big, and Ali will expose that.

 

how can you say that he went on to beat frazier and young right after that, idiot........ali against lyle had a very off night in that fight......and still KO's chinny wlad.

 

No large mystery. TS is a complete moron and one of the most consistently idiotic posters by some distance on ESB (with props to several other idiots - you know who you are).

Prime Ali wasn't an untalented bum like 96% or so of Klitschko opponents. Ali lost nearly 4 years of his prime. The is clearly a case of the TS being too young to have watched Ali's entire career in real time and thus being unable to judge his phenomenal abilities in a proper context.

Ali had two careers. One was based upon being far more talented, fast, and skilled than anyone else. The later one was based upon being so tough that he could take incredible amounts of punishment (to his long-term physical detriment) waiting for his opportunities to score points and defeat opponents.

His career ended about fifteen years earlier and nothing about either Klitschko is even in his class or at his talent level. The only factor that is even pertinent to evaluating the Klitschkos is their size advantage over third-rate bums and "C" level athletes in today's heavyweight division. The size differential between the Klitschkos and Ali would have been easily overcome by the comparable reach (80 inches versus 81 inches) combined with Ali's decent height (6'3") and the fact that he was twice as quick as either the lumbering giraffe (Vitali) or the meek fighting quail (Wlad).

The other point to consider is the obvious one that makes these era to era comparisons difficult and in this case impossible. Ali's influence and the impact he had upon the development of these later big men is inseparable. You can't have a Lennox Lewis (as he was) without there having been an Ali. That is how substantive Ali's position was in heavyweight history. The number of great fighters that owe their development to having watched Ali's work is significant. In Lennox's case, it would be like asking if the egg could defeat the chicken. Ali had better hand and foot speed to offset any size differential and "improvements" produced by the advancement of time and technology. Clearly if they could fight repeatedly there would be some great fights/moments/rounds between Ali's KOs and decisions over Lennox. In the Klitschko case, it would be like asking if a ******ed chick could kill it's mother. Impossible. They would be easily destroyed. Like any average athlete it is the punches you can't see that Ali would deliver that would end those one-sided beatdowns.

One only has to watch Corrie I Train On Beer And Donuts Sanders fight the Klitschkos to see they aren't great athletes (just decent large ones). If they are great than Corrie Sanders must be an ATG because he was kicking their ass as an old man. Does anyone really think Corrie Sanders is all that?

lol


Neither are the Klitschkos. That is certain beyond words.

 

your analysis on how Ali 'might' beat Wlad is on cue.

****. if they fought three times Wlad might win one of them.
Hard to analyze wlad until we see how his career pans out.

****ers aint giving him his props at all.

 

there is no version of Ali that knocks out Wlad, unless Wlad has a Foreman moment.
Or Ali TKO's him with cuts.


You can't take the speed and youth of a fighter and mix it with his jaw, seasoning and courage of his later years to create the perfect fighter.

You either get the fast 67' Ali, or the iron jawed clever older Ali of the early 70's. You can't have it both ways.

BTW....have you seen Ali-Young? I doubt you did.......or you wouldnt have brought it up