Is Aaron Pryor really an ATG?

Arguello was getting outboxed, outslicked by Marcel and Escalera too, they didnt have as much firepower, workrate, chin or strength to do what Pryor did.

Comparing Arguello's prime against Ali's primeness in the Foreman fight is laughable. The only emotion is Arguello fans who mythisise the man and cant accept his blatant flaws

The only reason Arguello wasn't prime against Pryor was because The Hawk landed about 1000 punches in Arguello's face, you wouldn't feel very prime if that happened to you either

Arguello never had any of the skills necessary to beat Pryor, he never had the footwork, movement, speed

 

Panama Lewis association = Possible Cheater.
(Kills his ATG status)

 

Bit of a no win situation for Pryor here. On one side he beat an AtG in Arguello twice. He dominated his division beating Antonio Cervantes, Dujuan Johnson and Miguel Montilla who'd only lost to the aforementioned. It could be argued that Pryor himself was only a lightweight.
On the other side, Arguello wasn't the same fighter as he had been a couple of years earlier IMO. Antonio Cervantes was past his peak and how good was Dujuan Johnson?
There is the question mark also about the black bottle. After the first fight Arguello had lost even more both mentally and physically.
Good fighter that Pryor was he wasn't as great as Arguello. when you look at the quality of their respective opposition.
At the end of the day wether he was as great as Arguello doesn't really matter, there are other ATG's who weren't as great as Arguello.
It all comes down to what we class as an ATG.
IMO Pryor great fighter, i speculate at him giving any lightwelter a fight but he just never fought at that consistently high level to call him ATG.

 

Leonard would've decapitated Pryor. That fact that Pryor wanted him only proves he had more guts than brains.
If you look strictly at his record, I'd say Pryor is an ATG. If you weigh in the taint of the first Arguello fight it's a much more difficult question.

 

Leonard wouldn't decapitated nothin. He probaly would win but fighter's like Pryor gave him trouble. And yes Aaron was an ATG imo.

 

Arguello was visibly slower and more stationary with the added weight. That was obvious even in his win over Kevin Rooney prior to the first Pryor fight.

 

I can understand the debate on just how much 'credit' Pryor should get for beating Arguello. IMHO some people do dismiss the wins too easily while others try to build too much around the same wins as regards Pryors achievements but I really don't see thats its debateable that a 30 year old fighter with 80+ fights on his record and fighting in the heaviest weight division of the 4 he campaigned at at top level is at least "past his prime".

 

This is true, but I also think we need to factor in the reality that Aguello was in his 19th world title fight, and Alexis was no cherry picker, He always targeted the dominant man. All you have to really do is watch the Escalera fights, and then watch Alexis struggle for the first 10 rounds against Mancinni, and it is obvious that he was slipping long before the Pryor fight.

 

Steroids AND hardcore stimulants, well above his best weight class a shop worn Alexis Arguello STILL managed to make a hell of a fight out of it.

THAT is what it means to be a true ATG. Pryor is not among the select greats of the sport. A H2H nightmare. Sure. Great? No.

 

What did Pryor admit to taking in that fight, and when?

 

Actually, start a poll if you like on Pac's PEAK weight. Remember, prime and peak are two different things. It would be an interesting thread.

Remember, Pac has had just 3 fights above 130. Tho VERY impressive i'd like to see a bit more. The other thing is even if he did find his own peak here it doesn't mean others did. A great many experts thought Benitez was finding his best at 154, which certainly adds interest for your side. Wilfred however rarely got hit solid ever and had bugger all wear physically.

Duran never ever beat Marcel at FW in his life sorry.

Also, was Arguello fighting at 126 right at the start of his career, or lighter? :hey

Pure speculation, this weight drained theory. Just because a fighter moves up doesn't mean they were automatically drained you know. As i said, Arguello targetted the record title and chose to move up and chase it. Hell, he was talking about moving up to 147 from lightweight to fight SRL, a full two divisions from the one he'd only just entered. Maybe he was drained at 140 too, hey? :hey

Then yet again we must come back to this age and ring wear thing. It refuses to go away and is a fact of nature.

I'll get into this properly at the end of my post, but there's every chance he might have been. He's an incredible fighter. The thing i will not accept is that Arguello was in his peak weight because he wasn't.

Well this very same man was making 126 and below for ages! Also, he came in at 122 for his first world title fight, way below the stipulated limit. It's not as simple as height.

I agree he was still effective and powerful at 140, but that is not the argument sorry.

No, but he would have suffered lossed thru old age and sheer ring wear

You keep assuming, then assume some more.

Also, don't get prime confused with PEAK. There's a difference.

Let me sum up. I'm not in any way saying the Arguello victory wasn't a great one for Pryor. I'm not in any way saying Arguello wasn't a fantastic opponent at 140. I'm not saying Pryor isn't a fantastic fighter.

Arguello obviously still had massive power and ability at 140. He had even more at 130, especially given his opponents had less.

Arguello fought a great fight vs Pryor, but Pryor was the better big man. He took punishment that would have knocked 130 pounders from their senses.

Going into the fight some of the great experts said Pryor could win it as long as he did this and that tactically. To everyone's surprise he did just that. It was well known Pryor's herky jerky wild style would give the control conscious and technically stiff Arguello fits if used to it's utmost.

Arguello was the most serious challenge Pryor had at the time anywhere in his division or below. Unfortunately there was a lack of great class and depth at the time. Just as unfortunate was Pryor missing his boat at 147 due to drug drama's and the like. If he kept it together he could have had a massive superfight vs Curry down the track when Curry stamped his mark.

 

I'm also going to put you and your friend on the stand.

When did Pryor admit to taking steroids for the Arguello fight?

Also, where is the actual proof of hardcore stimulants? We know that one was never proven even if possible or likely.

 

The way Im reading that is that Russ is talking more hypotheticals...Basically saying even if he did take all that a out of prime Arguello still gave him hell and that adds to the case that Pryor isnt a great.

But I could be wrong.

 

Pryor does not have the history of other greats, his most noticeable prime wins being against a most likely past it great moving up. And that win is most likely tainted, with very good reason.

So no, a good fighter but no way an atg.

 

Russ is accusing straight out he took steroids and hardcore stimulants as far as i can ascertain :huh

Certainly no may have's or might have's that i can find.