Fancy Footwork

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by IntentionalButt, Jul 3, 2009.


  1. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    Is this more or less a lost art? Particularly at the heavier weights. It seems watching film from the first half of the last century (post-Gentleman Jim, pre-Louisville Lip) that even the largest bodies bounced around gracefully on their toes, and were able to maintain full mobility and agility into late rounds without sacrificing balance or the ability to dig their heels and put starch on their punches. Modern era heavyweights (and even down the line a ways...at least into super middle) just don't seem to have that "cushion of air" under their feet. Even the best footwork displayed today is basically still plodding, it's just well-placed plodding that's thought out a moment or two in advance (say, Klitschko) rather than just stumbling instinctively in a given direction (say, Briggs).

    The thing that gets me is that these big men nowadays actually get winded barely lifting their feet off the ground (indeed, almost shuffling in slow motion) for 12 rounds or less, focusing most of their energy on the upper-body (throwing and slipping punches) - whereas champions bygone would literally stay on their toes such that they were able to effect leaping, strafing dodges deep into a fight (instead of just slipping, which seems to have been popularized and revolutionized a great deal in the latter day era) and still not appear to expend any less energy with their upper bodies than their successive counterparts.

    Is this a product of stylistic/coaching trends or laziness/decreased athleticism on the part of the newer school?
     
  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Well they're generally bigger guys.

    But I do think you make a good point about sylistic/coaching trends. There's a healthy stress upon doing things properly, and footwork is certainly the toughest department to "riff" on, to do your own thing on, in contradiction to what you are taught. I've wondered about this sometimes, and I wonder if a generation of guys turning up and trying to emulate Ali in the ring is what did it. That must have been infuriating for trainers.
     
  3. jaffay

    jaffay New Orleans Hornets Full Member

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    Evander Holyfield had some dance moves in the early 90's
     
  4. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    Jersey Joe Walcott was quite innovative, even since the Ali era of floating like a butterfly and all that were influenced by that.
     
  5. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    Even Ali (especially post-suspension, but before as well) with his floating didn't quite have the "bunny-hop" of prior generations. There's probably something to be said for McGrain's point - that the old-school heavies were more like LHW/Cruiserweights, but modern prizefighters just seem so much less sprightly on average. That's not to say that there hasn't been progression and innovation in other aspects of the game, but footwork seems to have taken a backward step, if you'll pardon the turn of phrase.
     
  6. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    It is interesting that Pacquiao's cosmic leap ahead of the pack occured at exactly the same time as his footwork took a similar leap.
     
  7. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    Right when I typed the word "bunny-hop", Manny started doing his roadrunner dance in my mind's eye. :lol: :thumbsup
     
  8. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    A great point. The development in Pacquiao's game has really brung home to me the importance of footwork. The difference is astonishing, and it's not something I ever placed much significance on before.

    I have recently been going back through some old fights and trying to focus more on footwork, those who utilized it well and those who did not.

    One definite thing I have noticed is: the heavyweights of the 70s and 80s absolutely shame the current bunch in terms of footwork. Early 90s Holyfield may as well be wearing ballet slippers, compared to the tree-trunks of the 2000s.

    I wouldn't try to pretend I'm some sort of authority on the subject, not by a long shot, but I do appreciate the brilliance of Bernard Hopkins's footwork in certain fights.
     
  9. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    But look back even further...at even an old Jou Louis, and the footwork - at least superficially - appears to be even better than most of the 70's guys. :huh
     
  10. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Jack Dempsey could do some weird things with his feet.

    Look at his creeping prowling aproach while coming forward!

    I suspect it takes a bit of perfecting.
     
  11. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    Why do you think so much emphasis has been taken away over the years from twinkletoeing? Is it that the "bit of perfecting" would eat up valuable time that trainers deem better spent on other skills? There are many recent heavyweights who could probably benefit greatly from improved lower-body coordination. Like if you could create some kind of centaurish creature that was David Tua from the waist up but an All-Star NBA point guard from the waist down...:scaredas:
     
  12. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    Gene Tunney made a significant contribution to the modernization of footwork...a point Muhannad Ali himself made when watching a film of Tunney-Dempsey.
     
  13. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    Of course, Tunney more or less refined what Jim Corbett had intoduced to the sport during his day.
     
  14. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    The fact that Tunney showed it first on film does not mean that he pioneered it.

    Jim Corbett activley courted recognition as an inovator of boxing technique.

    Gene Tunney only ever claimed to have taken the best of what was already known.
     
  15. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Spot on boys.


    As more empahsis is placed on size, and it's cousin power, it's a natural consequeunce that less empahisis is placed on mobility - that is entirely natural. There's a reason no HW fights like Marciano or Frazier these days, you aren't carrying 230 and fighting like that.

    Secondly, check the emphasis on reach. Post Tyson, 5 HW's are looking for births in the top 25 HW's - Holyfield, Bowe, Klitschko x2 and Lewis. Four of the five stress range in their boxing to some degree. Range calls for balance but not mobility. These promotes the type of footwork you are deriding.

    I agree with your broad point, but I think you are being a little hard on today's big boys.