Should there be an end to catch weights regarding PACMAN??

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by elguapo, Jul 10, 2009.


  1. ApatheticLeader

    ApatheticLeader is bringing ***y back. Full Member

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    No offence, but that's bull****.

    Pac IS better than Cotto, but this is something that's not based on the result of this fight, but of the abilities both fighters have shown up to this point. If Pac loses, he's still clearly a better fighter than Cotto.

    And nothing is made equal here, Cotto would be more comfortable at 147 than 143. Pacquiao would be more comfortable at a lighter weight than 143. So basically a big part of what could decide this fight is who is suffering more at this unnatural weight? And that, under NO circumstances should be a factor in any supposedly level field.
     
  2. Kurdapyo

    Kurdapyo Active Member Full Member

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    I am talking about the possible result of a hypothetical fight. Assuming that they agree to fight at a catchweight which was done in the case of dela Hoya Hopkins, Pavlik-Taylor, etc., the winner is the better fighter. If Pac wins, he is the better fighter. If Cotto wins, he is the better fighter. Obviously, isn't it? But if they fight at a weight advantageous to one fighter, you cannot determine who is the better fighter. They should therefore agree to fight at an agreed contracted weight.
     
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Catchweights are as old as the sport, almost. There is absolutley nothing wrong with them in any way shape or form.
     
  4. Mr Butt

    Mr Butt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    if pac wants to fight cotto then cotto is a welterweight so the fight limit should be 147 why cotto has to lose extra weight is just pac`s people just trying to get an edge cotto should say **** you ,you want my tittle come get it
     
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    On the one hand, you're right, Cotto should back out if he can't make weight, on the other hand there's nothing in the rules that says a fight for the 147lb title has to be fought at 147lbs. Just above 140.
     
  6. Mr Butt

    Mr Butt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    i am not saying there is anything wrong with catchweight fights i just think cotto`s people should give there man his best chance
     
  7. ApatheticLeader

    ApatheticLeader is bringing ***y back. Full Member

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    The fight is disadvantageous to BOTH fighters, and whoever suffers the least has a disproportionate over the other, which is just plain wrong. It's the same with every catchweight - Hopkins/Pavlik is the best example of this.

    And no, one fight between two men does NOT decide the better fighter outright. Take Paul Williams vs. Quintana, which is one of millions of examples. Quintana won, but are do you actually think Quintana is better than Williams? What about any number of "Fighter A beats Fighter B, Fighter B beats C, Fighter C beats A" scenarios. If fighter A beat B, it means he's better than him, despite the fact Fighter B beat the man who beat Fighter A?
    It's closer to deciding who was better on the night, but that's about it.

    And with catchweights, it doesn't even totally decide that, because if Fighter A (who is massively disadvantaged at the weights) give Fighter B (who is less disadvantaged) hell, then Fighter A put up the better performance, even if Fighter B won.
     
  8. ApatheticLeader

    ApatheticLeader is bringing ***y back. Full Member

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    I had less against them when there were less weight divisions. You can't advocate catchweights and complain about too many weight divisions.
     
  9. Mr Butt

    Mr Butt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    yes true but as cotto`s tittle will be at stake then if he weighs in at 147 that is fine, if pac wants to weigh 142 thats fine too
     
  10. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Of course you can. Freddie Roach certianly is! And I don't recall this hysteria when Pavlik-Hopkins was made at 170.

    Catchweights are just an easy way for a fight to be made. You won't see Cotto making 145 for someone who isn't bringing him millions.
     
  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Well..obviously this is fine, but i'm just telling you that if the title is at stake and Pacquiao wins and they both weighed in at 141, the title will change hands. Even if there is NO catchweight agreement.
     
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Definitely.
     
  13. ApatheticLeader

    ApatheticLeader is bringing ***y back. Full Member

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    I bitched like never before when that fight was made! I was MUCH more pissed then than I am now. That fight was distortion personified.

    And catchweights are an easy way for fights to be made, but they end up with distorted results due to the supposedly "levelling out" of the playing field and end up proving nothing. This fight will prove nothing at all. This fight means more money for everyone concerned, so of course they are to want it. I don't blame anyone concerned on that front. But as far as boxing is concerned, it's not good for it.
     
  14. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Well there's no way this is true. When Barney Ross beat Jimmy McLarnin for the ww title of the world fought at 145, it didn't prove "nothing". Surley you learned something about Bernard Hopkins when watching him dismantle Pavlik? Pavlik cememted his superiority over Taylor at a catchwieght, i certainly learned something there.
     
  15. Mr Butt

    Mr Butt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    yeah, i just feel if you are going want someones tittle have the balls fight them at there normal fight weight