Since when did Pac become Willie Pep?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by lern1079, Jul 24, 2009.


  1. lern1079

    lern1079 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    It was just an eye catching title. Why don't you two guys comment on the body of the thread. You two are the only ones taking the title literally.
     
  2. DLSC

    DLSC Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Ok then. I agree w/ most of what you said except for the boxing aptitude. I think Pac has more to offer. He's a quick learner, still wants to learn a lot despite his impressive record, a very intelligent fighter. I'm basing this on how he reacts and tries to improve after every fight.

    Don't get me wrong. I also like Cotto. He also has great skills. Only my opinion though.
     
  3. PH|LLA

    PH|LLA VIP Member Full Member

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    the criticism that Pac was only a jab-jab-left fighter was incorrect from the beginning.
     
  4. lern1079

    lern1079 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    So even when Freddy Roach said that he was mostly a left handed fighter is also incorrect?
     
  5. PH|LLA

    PH|LLA VIP Member Full Member

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    when all the doubters were saying that all Pac could do was jab-jab-straight left hand, they were incorrect.
     
  6. lern1079

    lern1079 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    But even Freddy Roach said it.
     
  7. Pimp C

    Pimp C Too Much Motion Full Member

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    I dont know but a lot of his fans think he has great defense all of a sudden. Pac is very flawed on defense he comes in wild and off balanced far to often.
     
  8. PH|LLA

    PH|LLA VIP Member Full Member

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    saying that someone is primarily a left handed fighter and saying someone can only throw a jab-jab-left is completely different. How can you miss that?

    another thing is that a big part of Pac's defense is blocking and parrying punches with his guard, another skills that gets overlooked.
     
  9. Babality

    Babality KTFO!!!!!!! Full Member

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    People say he's improved defensively.

    Improved =/= Willie Pep.
     
  10. BlueApollo

    BlueApollo Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    For the most part, well said. What you have to give Manny and Roach credit for though is that the skills they have worked on particularly hard to improve complement his existing tool set incredibly well. He has amazing natural speed, so they worked on his jab, shortening his punches and learning basic counters. He has good natural head movement, so they worked on getting under punches, bobbing and weaving. He has incredible power, so they worked on turning over and finishing punches.

    He should never be mentioned with the all time technical greats, but he is currently a damned good technical fighter, on top of being a wildly talented athlete. It's a dangerous combination and fun as hell to watch.
     
  11. lern1079

    lern1079 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Don't tap dance around the issue. You know what the critism was of Pac. We all do. That was his bread and butter, the double jab-left cross that is why it comes up so often.

    If you are mainly a one handed fighter regardless of what combination you threw or not it still makes you a technically limited fighter.
     
  12. PH|LLA

    PH|LLA VIP Member Full Member

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    Everyone has their bread and butter. Even the very technically gifted fighters... Pernell had the jab, Oscar had his left hook, Hopkins has the lead right hand. That doesn't make them technically limited fighters. Pac has long been able to throw a variety of punches effectively and in different situations. He is just even better at it now.
     
  13. lern1079

    lern1079 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I would be dumb not to understand that Roach has helped him hone that natural talent into a more developed boxer and give him credit for doing so but I just think that when viewing Pac you need to take things into perspective. When evaluating any fighter, even Cotto.

    I just think the fanatasism in these boards is just blurring some peoples rationalizing skills.
     
  14. lern1079

    lern1079 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Yes every great fighter has a signature punch, I agree. Pac used to rely heavily on that combination. It was at times that he would over use it. I mean if you don't agree than fine but the whole boxing world that has been following Pac knows what I am referring to. I am not saying that he did not know how to throw another punch because even those of us that don't have any boxing training know how to throw different punches. They may not be the most technically perfect in form but we know how to throw them.

    So you can go back in the archives and of course you are going to find Pac throwing something other than that combination.
     
  15. borj

    borj the Pacific Storm Full Member

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    define this one please