Was Demspey's duck of Greb even more blatant than his duck of Wills?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Aug 16, 2009.


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  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Absolutely. But even for him, the last time the Dempsey match was seriously considered he made it clear he "wouldn't be fighting for free" (i think he knew he couldn't win by that point) and when he ditched Red Mason for alternative management, money seemed to be his motivating factor.
     
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    #46
  2. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    That's a silly, idealistic way of thinking. Very few fighters take up boxing for the love of getting punched in the face. Every boxing bio I can ever remember reading confesses it was for the dough. Not for internet dorks a century hence.
     
    Seamus, Aug 16, 2009
    Seamus, Aug 16, 2009
    #47
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I agree with you that fighters fight primarily for cash, so does everyone else on the forum.
     
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    #48
  4. OLD FOGEY

    OLD FOGEY Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    It is also not as if Dempsey was not offered huge amounts of money time and again to fight Wills. Most observers back in the 1920's thought a Dempsey-Wills fight would be the biggest gate of them all.
     
    OLD FOGEY, Aug 16, 2009
    OLD FOGEY, Aug 16, 2009
    #49
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    There was money for the Greb fight too, which almost came off at least three times. At one point it even looked as though they were going to do a Langford-Ketchel and put on a shorter fight (8 rounds) with a view to putting on a longer fight at a later date (which may or may not have happened...).

    Never mind.
     
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    #50
  6. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Well Dempsey seems to have made a sincere effort to arrange a fight with Wills and even to have gone out of his way to do it.

    He made no apparent effort to arrange a fight with Greb.

    Somtimes the truth is stranger than fiction.
     
    janitor, Aug 16, 2009
    janitor, Aug 16, 2009
    #51
  7. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    He did talk about a fight with Greb though, and he also sat down with at least one promoter to talk terms on his own (after the split with Bad Jack) with Kearns also sitting down to negotiate at least once (possibly twice).

    It's not a point of view you will share, but I think he made moves in direct keeping with the amount of pressure exherted by the public.

    Another thing; Wills is a better HW than Greb for sure. But I like Greb's chacnes against Demspey better. I pick Dempsey to beat Wills. But I pick Greb to beat Dempsey, in all honesty, based upon what I know.

    That being said, maybe the truth is in keeping with a reality recognised by the principles...or perhaps not.
     
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    #52
  8. OLD FOGEY

    OLD FOGEY Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Well, perhaps I didn't make my point well, but what I meant is that Dempsey could have defended against Wills and Greb while making a great deal of money, possibly even more than he did with his actual defenses. Greb, for example, would almost certainly have been a bigger draw than Miske, Brennan, or Gibbons, all of whom he had defeated.
     
    OLD FOGEY, Aug 16, 2009
    OLD FOGEY, Aug 16, 2009
    #53
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Yeah, I got that and I agree. WHat I was saying was there was so much interest it was thought at one time that the two could box twice, once in a NWS decision bout over 8-10 and once for the title over 10 plus.

    Greb was also being lined up for a warm up bout before Tunney at one point :lol: You can bet Dempsey nixed that one.

    Or his people, should I say. Maybe.
     
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    #54
  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Mac, I can't refute any of your excellently constructed points.
    So, being that I am pissed .Man to Man Dempsey vGreb, ditto Wills ,who do you pick?
     
    mcvey, Aug 16, 2009
    mcvey, Aug 16, 2009
    #55
  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    :lol:

    I've got Dempsey beating Wills and Greb beating Dempsey or doing very very very well at the very least.

    You have Dempsey beating both?
     
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    #56
  12. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Yes I do .
    I am aware that Harry and Loughran ,both made Jack look silly in sparring, and I dont buy the crap that Dempsey took it easy on them.
    If he could have nailed them he would have.
    But,sparring ,and championship distance fights are something else.
    Sorry about the spacing,as I said ,I hAVE DRINK TAKEN,WELL,IT IS sUNDAY LUNCHTIME.
     
    mcvey, Aug 16, 2009
    mcvey, Aug 16, 2009
    #57
  13. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    You are right of course - let me ask, who you would you favour over 8? Greb or Dempsey?

    :lol::lol:
     
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    McGrain, Aug 16, 2009
    #58
  14. JimmyShimmy

    JimmyShimmy 1050 psi Full Member

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    When you say 'duck' you are suggesting avoidance out of fear of losing. This is not true.

    Now quit with the rhetoric you jargonised revisionists!
     
    JimmyShimmy, Aug 16, 2009
    JimmyShimmy, Aug 16, 2009
    #59
  15. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    I dn't think that Dempsey ever entertained the idea that he would loose to Wills but Greb?

    Perhaps even the devil himself can know fear.
     
    janitor, Aug 16, 2009
    janitor, Aug 16, 2009
    #60
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