Do you love Muhammad Ali? If so why so and if not why not?

- He had the balls to say what others were afraid to say, and during a time when you simply didn't say it...

- He was one of the first natural heavyweights to adapt a boxing style that abandoned the traditional techniques that were used by a lot of natural heavys.

- He had the guts and courage to fight anyone and everyone, or at least until the very late part of his career. From about 1975-1978, he was probably padding his record some, but I would never doubt the man's heart for even split second..

 

- he was a racist
- he was a womanizing douche who repeatedly cheated on his wives
- The way he treated frazier was ****ing dispicable
- the Ali Legend has made it impossible to have a real discussion about any of the 70's heavyweights.
-The Ali "legend" also spawned the Ali magick **** talking myth wherein any fantasy fight where's physically outmatched, he'll magically win by "getting in his opponents head" via **** talking

 

Although I don't particularly like these criticisms, I must confess that most of them are valid ones.

 

:yep:good

 

A lot of people are sick of him, including myself, because of who he was, because of the fact so many pre-pubescent kids and lads down at the pub seem to think he's the only boxer along with Tyson that ever existed. Thats human nature. Obviously though if you analyse what he did specifically in the ring then he's right up there with the best of the best, but my god does it grate on me when you get Joe Bloggs downing his pint quoting Ali and saying he's the greatest annd having no knowledge of anyone or anything else. Hollywood eh!

 

Bit of a racist, bit of a **** at times.

But he was a great fighter and thuroughly entertaining. There is so mnay great interviews with the guy and obviously so many great fights...

I suppose you could say I have mixed opinions of him

 

I've probably made it so obvious on this forum I do indeed love Muhammad Ali. As to Mesmerfrog's criticisms,nobody is perfect. If you'd had Ali's looks and status etc.would n't you be,at least tempted to be a womaniser ? I'm not saying that it's the right way to behave,but Ali was a charismatic young man in the most charismatic position in the world (heavyweight champion) temptation can rear it's ugly head. Ali is the first to admit that he took his act too far where Frazier is concerned. When you put on an entertaining show like Ali did it must be hard,sometimes to know where to draw the line. Frazier was sometimes out of order as well. He's been on record for years as badmouthing Ali in the press,yet when he's been featured on documentaries with him it's all "Ladies and gentlemen we all love Ali" Especially the This Is Your Life show. This all happened a long time ago. Also,being a fan of Ali does n't stop me being rational when it comes to debate about 70's heavyweights. This will be an interesting debate though.

 

Of course i love the guy. Ever since i can remember i knew who Muhammed Ali was. Then I started wathcing boxing and some of the first fights i watched was Ali's and he is mesmerising the way he runs rings round Liston and Williams. Its just brilliant to watch.

Also he had that great sense of humour and is just hilarious in interviews, so much charisma and character. Also his intelligece and wit is excellant.

Some people mark him down as a rascist and he was. But hes not anymore in fact hes probably one of the first names you'd think of when you mentioned Black and White Unity. He appeals to every race ow and he encourages unity and peace.

His womanising ways has also been brought up but everyone has their weaknesses and women was his. Most great fighters vice is woman. Even Alexis Arguello was a womaniser.

 

of course its a weakness but it aint a particulary bad one, it could be worse.

 

As a fighter, he was great. Not necessarily The Greatest but definitely great.

As a historical figure he's overrated. Or at least he's misrepresented. People talk about him as if he was seriously some sort of champion for civil rights, freedom and progress. But he wasn't. Anyone can do the research and uncover the fact he was totally out of step in his thinking with both the moderate "civil rights" and the more radical "black liberation" crowds, clasically represented by Martin Luther King and Malcolm X respectively.

The man Ali backed fanatically and continuously from the 60s through to the mid-late 70s was Elijah Muhammad, who was admittedly an inspiration to the downtrodden blacks of the 40s, 50s and early 60s, but frankly and obviously a nut - and his claims were laughable to any intelligent progressive person certainly by the end of the 1960s.
Malcolm X was killed in 1965, and by then all black muslims and all black radicals were free to make up their minds whether what Malcolm was saying towards the end made more sense in those times than what Elijah Muhammad was saying.

Elijah Muhammad wanted a severely segragated America, a turning back of the clock, no "race-mixing", with black people living under his "prophethood", and hanging on to his silly stories as gospel truths, no involvement with politics, educated in the ways of his self-fabricated religion that he had the audacity to call "Islam". He cared not for civil rights nor for revolution.

That's all very well. I have no problem with Ali for following that creed. No one said boxers had to be intelligent people.

But why then is Ali revered as something he's not ?
Why is he introduced as someone who did so much for black people ?
What did he do ?
From where I'm sitting, when it came to issues of blacks and whites he ranted some embarrassingly bad stuff in the 1960s, spoke out for the American apartheid system rather than against it.

Sorry for the essay, but this thing about Ali totally baffles me.