Middleweight Tournament: Quarter Final Rpy Jones Jr. vs Carlos Monzon

Well Monzon absolutely dominated Napoles though..really not relevant IMO. Different fighters and both showed different abilities past welter...Griffith was proper proven at middle IMO and ranks pretty well H2H there.

Griffith went over to Denmark to be the first to be beat an excellent technician in Tom Bogs..who outweighed him by a fair bit from memory..There are several fights in Emile's career where he was outweighed by quality fighters and was able to overcome them.

I cant see what your getting at to tell you the truth PP...???

 

The fact is people can criticise and make excuses to downgrade anyones wins, Toney and Hopkins were far nearer to their prime than these 2 and actually at their prime weights

For the record Napoles never had any other fights above WW, Griffith was probably 5years removed from his prime at 34 too. Benvenuti was also probably past prime, smaller and coming off recent loses too

 

Carlos Monzon, UD.

Roy Jones Jr.'s unorthodoxness, and hand speed prove mettlesome for Monzon in the early RD's. Monzon works his trademark left jabs. Roy would have none of it, and gets some good shots, wins the first 2 rounds and probably knocks Monzon down. Without a hint of expression, Monzon manages to dictate the pace, and get comformtable with the timing. 1-2 basic combinations, followed by occasional uppercuts...Monzon's reach looks like it has gotten to Roy, and whenever Roy would try to get inside, he will feel the surprising strength of Monzon's Clinches. Monzon gets a knockdown on him, RD 14, and eventually wins a UD.

 

You reckon Nard was "far nearer" to his prime?

Nard struggled a bit in harsh conditions against that mediocre south american dude not long after the Roy fight...He then fought guys who wouldnt really gauge much of his ability at the stage.

Emile was beating a 29 year old only once previously beaten Benvenuti, a pretty damn decent version of a very decent fighter in Dick Tiger and an unbeaten Tom Bogs, among others when he was campaigning at middle.

Maybe Griffith wasnt prime...but the fact he was knocking off quality opposition still would indicate he wasnt to far out or at least it was a very gradual slide.

 

Hopkins-Mercado was a controversal 1 that ringsiders had Hopkins winning but regardless Hopkins avenged that draw, anyone can have a 1 off poor performance anyway, Emile had plenty of losses of his own.

Emile was 4years removed from his BEnevuti win and this would be his last top draw win. Griffith would never score a top win again after Monzon and be a long losing streak. His recent Dick Tiger win pre-Monzon was a past prime Tiger too coming off a devastating loss and he had 4 losses in 4years prior to facing Monzon. Then again he was always an inconsistant fighter, which is why I wouldn't rate him as high as Hopkins/Toney prime for prime anyway

 

A few thoughts come to mind, I will focus on the ones that helped me draw to my conclusion the most.

Now, I think Roy has the foot and hand speed to outbox Monzon for a fair amount of time. I think he might just be the worst stylistic matchup I can think of for Monzon, as he will be able to negate Monzon's timing in the later rounds with his own impeccable head/upper body movement/feints.

Now the 2nd thing is that I don't believe Jones had an awful chin. I'm one of the people that are firmly in the camp of 'too much weight draining did his pins a disservice'.

Over the last three rounds Monzon is going to be at his best, trying to pile on the punches and get Jones out of there, knowing he is behind on points. Still, Roy could use a pretty good 'turtle guard' to block himself, and had strong arms/body to withstand shots designed to break down his resolve.

As not many will go for him as much as anything (and for the fact that I believe my above analysis a perfectly viable one if not the one that crops up in a series of five fights) I say Jones manages to affect Monzon's timing up until the latter stages of the middle part of the fight. Monzon has been totally outclassed and is causing Roy troubles of his own with his strudy shots and ring generalship, and has dissuaded Jones by taking anything that has been thrown at him. Monzon has come on strong in the last fe rounds but Jones survuves an wins a 9-6 in a fight that for the better part has been boring.

Roy Jones via decision

 

Jones UD

He's a freak and i think he has the speed, elusiveness and stamina to stave off Monzon.

 

15 rounds. Jones is not going to like 15 rounds with Monzon. Monzon late TKO.

 

Rpy has this one in the bag. Not sure about Roy, though.

 

Should've said that this morning when I noticed itatsch

Wouldn't usually but Pater has become known for being a grammatical snob as of late, always pulling people up for their spelling mistakes.

I can't help it if I pisspronounce my worms.

 

A little unfair classifying Jones as a Middleweight, as his best work was done from 168 up .. And your putting him in with the greatest Middleweight ever. Jones really shouldnt have been in this tournament, he should be in the 168 (which he'd win) or the 175 (which he'd lose in the final against Ezzard Charles) ..

Monzon would win this because Jones wasnt an experienced Middleweight when he fought at that weight. If Jones was a natural 160 fighter whose career had longevity there then i'd go for Jones no doubt, if anybody could take Monzon down it would be Jones. Jones is a vastly under appreciated fighter on forums like these as is Pernell Whitaker and Floyd Mayweather, these fighters are phenomenal.

 

This isn't about putting in fighters that are definitely going to win.

It's a mix of very accomplished fighters and fighters that are deemed considerably hard to beat H2H.

Young Roy Jones is still a nightmare for most at Middle. The fact he's getting votes against Monzon is a testament to this. You wouldn't have thought Tiger Flowers would get this far; better than the usual Monzon vs Hagler if Roy goes through that's for sure, evident in the recent LW tournament in which Floyd 'beat' Ike Williams.

It's things like this that keep the board alive, fresh debate and controversial decisions (though Roy-Monzon has been done before for sure, a few times)

 

Please, can we not mention Bernard Hopkins in this thread ?? We are mentioning stellar Champions and Truly Great fighters here in Monzon, Jones, Toney, Napoles and Griffiths .. Hopkins doesnt deserve to be mentioned in the same paragraph let alone the same sentence as these guys .. Hopkins is an average fighter who developed a very tricky effective style after he was taken to school by Jones. Respect to Hopkins but so many people go over board with praise for Bernard .. Does anybody believe that Jones or Monzon would be getting into ungainly ugly brawls with guys like Antwun Echols or Robert Allen ? Jones and Monzon would have these guys for breakfast and look good doing it ..

I havent heard anybody mention Monzon's great wins against Rodrigo Valdez or Bennie Briscoe yet, these 2 guys were top drawer quality fighters ..

Please, no more on Hopkins, lets be serious ..

 

Jones UD

His speed and unorthodoxness would cause Monzon massive issues, Monzons jab would be renderd redunant and he lacks the footspeed to corner Roy.

The fact that Jones was green at MW is not a good point, Jones beat Toney in his first fight out of MW shows that his ability was still very much the unreal fighter that everybody remembers. He was not too green.

 

First of all atsch:shock:

Second, B-Hop stopped Glen Johnson. Did Roy? Or did he.....oh. Oh, yeah I remember what happened.

This is coming from a massive Jones fan, just showing you what a ****in moron you are:good