Jeffries-Johnson coverage describe unlisted Johnson fights[boxrec].

What Johnson's record never conveys is his reputation, which was something to be reckoned with when he was climbing.

Choynski was a great veteran, but after tasting a bit of Johnson he knew what he was dealing with. This guy could move and he was as powerful as a truck. When folk crowded around Johnson to view him spar they could see how easily he tied his man and refuted any attempts of offense. He had an impregnability about him that was daunting and commanded interest.

There were the ever present racists that continually harped on about the physical differences of the black man, which led to illogical stabs at science like Johnsons rips are a bit too high to take a body shot well. Then there were the purists, who had nothing but praise for the dangerous splice of brains and brawn he clearly had.

Sure, Langford was a killer, but he did not have that empiric demeanour of Johnson who was also far better at talking the talk.

The fact Johnson got a shot at Burns showed how much of an impact he had had on the consciousness of 'White America'.

 

More attune to the thread, there will be a great deal of Johnson fights that will never be retrieved, simply for the fact the guy had dust-ups in the most obscure of places and times, whether it to be for some spare change or to prove a point.

 

Mcarmick is probably Jim Mc Cormick(or McCormack) and if my memory is correct Lawlor fought in the Texas area. My guess is these fights happened but I'll try a little checking.

 

I am on a business trip, but the ring results are just that. Johnson wasn't a serious contender until the sun set on Fitzsimmons and Corbett.

When I first started reviewing records with a fine toothed comb, I was surprised that Choynski, Klondike, Hart and Griffin got the better of Johnson, but McVey, Langford and Jeannette could not.

The truth is this. Choynski, Hart, Klondike, and Griffin were not green fighters, they were not old fighters, and they were more or less close in size to Johnson. And, Johnson lost to each of these men because unlike Langford they were not 156 pounds. Unlike McVey they were not teenagers, and unlike Jeanette they were not a raw novice with a losing or .500 record.

Does anyone disagree or agree with the above statements?

In my opinion Johnson began to come into his own around 1906-1907. Much has been made about Choynski showing Johnson a thing or two about boxing when they were in jail. While this is true, the things Choysnki showed Johnson did not help his results for the next few years.

I tend to think Johnson put it all together and developed John Ruiz like jab and clinch style, mixed in with a very good uppercut. Johnson said he learned the upper cut from Griffin. This " new style " limited Johnson's chances of being Ko'd by the bigger punchers since his chin vs hitters who actually landed punches was suspect. It also took advantage of his strength.

Here something to re-seaarch. Do reports on Johnson pre Marvin Hart speak of excessive clinching? The ones I read suggest more action.

Joe Choynski did not fight like John Ruiz. Choynski used quick used movement and a left hook.

 

Choynski was an old fighter in boxing terms and several years past his best, Martin, McVea and Jeannette were as big as Choynsky, Klondike and Griffin and Hart. Langford was small and light but he wasn't green.
I too have been surprised by Johnson's set-backs but there is no obvious pattern. But make no mistake by the time he was beating Childs and Martin he was a serious contender. Kennedy, Russel, Griffin, Gardner etc were fringe contenders.

 

Just caught your post ,I have been in Brussels.
I have the following.
1895 Dave Pierson w Galveston.
1895 Bob Thompson l dec 4 Galveston.
1896.Howard Pollar w Galveston.
1897.Jim Rocks w ko4 Galveston.
1897.Sam Smith,w dec10 Galveston.
1898.Reddy Bremer,wko3 Galveston.
1898.Jim Cole wdec4 Galveston.
1898.Henry Smith.d 15 Galveston.
1899 Feb11th Jim McCormick d 7 Galveston
1899 March17 th JimMcCormick w dsq7 Galveston
1899.May6th Klondike lko5 Chicago

1899 Dec16th Pat Smith d 12 Galveston
1900 Josh Smith wdec12 Memphis
I have 118 fights listed for Johnson to Box rec's 102.
My source is "In the Ring And Out".
The ring record was compiled by Gilbert Odd ,it's Editor.
With the following comment.
"The records of earlier fighters ring activities are allways obscure and notoriously difficult to compile.
In the days before sophisticated,PR techniques,and complex tax considerations,a boxer customarily fought scores ,even hundreds of poorly documented contests,-sometimes two , or three on the same day- at both ends of a noteworthy career..
The following is the result of many years of research and is probably the most accurate and complete record of Jack Johnson ever published.
If you want all those listed Mac, I will try and up load them .

I have Horace Miles down as having fought Johnson in 1901 a ko win for Johnson in 3 rds, the fight in Galveston.

I have three fights with Griffin in 1902 .All draws

June20 10 rds Los Angeles
July 4th 20 rds Los Angeles
Sept ? 20rds Los Angeles.

I have an addtional Kennedy fight, a week after there Mar7th 4rdko win for Johnson,which took place in Oakland.
I have Johnson koing Kennedy on Mar 15th in San Francisco.

The Jim Scanlan fight was on May 1st a 7rd ko for Johnson.

ps Johnson gave two boxing exhibitions in Rosherville Gardens ,in Kent, opposite where my girlfriend lives now.
I HAVE NO AGENDA HERE NOR DESIRE TO ENGAGE IN A DISPUTE WITH A CERTAIN MEMBER,. WHO SHALL BE NAMELESS