Where is RJJ as an ATG

Yeah... I think it's time you changed the subject and ducked out the back door too. This wasn't go well.

Let me help you understand; Jones should not, and did not need to lose to Tarver, Johnson, or Calzaghe, but because he's a MENTAL MIDGET, and couldn't handle ONE setback, he lost those fights in a self doubting stupor of fear, hesitation, and personal demons. This is BOXING, buddy boy. Check the sign on the ****ing door. Watch a Hollywood movie about boxing if have to. Even they know.

 

Jones was by far my favorite boxer to watch, but even I can't put him in the top 25 or 30. Even in his prime, Montell Griffin in their first bout made Jones seem ordinary rather than extraordinaary. Anyway with that said, I would put him in the upper 40s or 50s.

 

He may have looked ordinary, I would say uninspired. Now the second fight, he was full of inspiration.

 

Ok Larry Merchant....I put jones even money with anyone at 175 you have rated ahead of him. Favorite depending on who.

 

But that isn't the ****ing point is it?

 

so why a remath at 175 with toney never happened ?
at 175 even i prefer roy to win over toney with toney's performances against griffinX2 and thadzi.
but above 175 - i wonder how jones would fare against toney , byrd , orlin norris.
a 190 fight with toney would have been more than great.
the toney who beat holyfield and jirov would have been a much bigger problem for roy.

 

All things considered, resume-wise, adversity, wins, etc., top 40 all time. IMO He dominated the sport for a long time so that counts for something.

But as far as his ability? I've never seen anybody on film, and Ive seen alot, close to what he can do in the ring. Maybe Sam Langford or John L. Sullivan or some other fighter from 100 years in the past that no film exists on could have possibly been better, cause I cant rightfully judge them if ive never seen them actually box, but I highly doubt it.

 

Definately in the top 50 of all time

 

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Meanwhile, James Toney was the name on everyone's lips after destroying the majority of his opposition and building an impressive 44-0-2 record which included some of the best middleweights of that era. From the time he ripped the IBF Middleweight crown off Michael Nunn's head, who was 36-0 at the time, Toney appeared invincible. He successfully defended his title on six occasions against quality opposition such as Mike McCallum and Reggie Johnson before stepping up to 167lbs where he battered Iran Barkley to become an undefeated, two division champ. Before he met RJJ he had another 10 bouts including 3 successful title defences.

By the time Roy Jones finally faced James Toney it was felt that Toney would hold to many guns for Jones but what followed was the complete domination of Toney with Jones outclassing him in every facet of the fight. In fact Jones was so great that some found it hard to believe what they witnessed and it wasn't long before the excuses and negativity spewed from the mouths of "fight fans."

All of a sudden James Toney wasn't that great any more.

So Roy Jones Jr rolled onwards and upwards, smashing Vinny Pazienza and Eric Lucas among others before the 5'11'' champion that started his career at junior middleweight decided to step up to light heavyweight. This was when he really came alive and showed the world how great he really was. Forget any other boxer that has fought since Sugar Ray Robinson, RJJ's abilities were so magnificent that he made champions look average. Mike McCallum, Viril Hill, Montell Griffin, Eric Harding, etc, all champions in their own right who had no answer to RJJ's brilliance.

And then he done the impossible by defeating John Ruiz for the heavyweight title, an accomplishment so difficult it had only happened on one other occasion....more than 100 years ago!

Yet although Jones, giving away 33lbs, dominated the WBA heavyweight champion of the world, there were those that wouldn't give him the credit deserved. Ruiz was a man that had three very close, tough fights with a legend named Holyfield yet after Jones beat Ruiz we heard the negative comments once more.

Sure Ruiz aint the excitment machine we enjoyed during Tyson's reign but he was a worthy champion regardless what one may think of his tactics and his record proves that with wins over Rahman, Holyfield, Golota and close losses to Valuev and Chagaev.

After he beat Ruiz his record was 49 fights for 48 wins with 1 loss by DQ. At that stage he was considered by most objective fight fans as one the greatest boxers of the modern era and had he retired there and then.......it would only be fair to rate him alongside the ATG's as he was invincible and without peer.

If RJJ doesn't enjoy his time in the ring then no-one does and that's why he's still fighting but anyone that uses his recent record as evidence of mediocrity needs to get an education. To drop back from heavyweight to lightheavyweight and lose 18lbs of muscle in the process is difficult at best, dangerous at worst, which is why Roy Jones Jr was the first man ever as reigning heavyweight champ to drop down and win the light heavyweight title.

WHAT MORE DOES A MAN HAVE TO DO ? Could he have won those 49 fights in better style than he did?

As elite sportsmen get older the first thing that deteriorates is the reflexes, co-ordination, leg speed and agility. A fighter that relies on power will not be as affected as someone who relies on their natural gifts like RJJ and that's why he came undone.

He had slipped those punches thousands of times but when Tarver and Johnson threw those bombs he just failed to react as he would have in his prime. Anyone who believes that the RJJ we've seen over the past few years is the same one that dominated the 90's should seek medical attention because it's deluded.

Funny though how the same people overlook the average form of Sugar Ray Robinson towards the end of his career.

 

co-sign his placement is up for debate but top 50 fo sure ..

 

Top 20

 

Ali lost 3 of his last 4 fights. He was stopped by Holmes, lost to a kid with seven pro fights and embarrassed by Berbick.

And he's the greatest!

Roy, at 35, was undefeated in 49 fights (technically, he had a DQ , but he showed what he thought there in the rematch).

Titles at MW, SMW, LHW, and HW.

Victories over BHOP, Toney, Hill and Ruiz.

What he did AFTER prime counts for **** all in my book.

I still have Ali in the #1 spot.


Jones is no lower than top dozen.

 

Somewhere around the fourty mark, his talent deserves more though.

 

He was shot against Calzaghe.

Past his prime when he fought Johnson/Tarver.

 

Top 20

His career was coming to an end by the time he faught tarver the first time but dropping 18 lbs of muscle didnt help his cause. He still won the first tarver fight aged 34/35 (as was tarver although roy relied on speed and reflexes more than anything).