David Haye can Beat Vitali

Haye shouldn't even be put in the same sentence with Vitali yet. Vitali is a proven and accomplished HW champion. Haye at the moment is just a wanna be who thinks that he can win a belt just by running his mouth. I don't think Haye can even last 8 rounds with Vitali. If he looks impressive against Valuev, my opinion might change but I don't think he will.

 

Haye is not a boxer, he's a brawler/stalker. He's not a disciplined fighter, and particularly not as a HW with the extra bulk. His conditioning and stamina have never been his strong suit and that is only magnified as he moves up.

At some point, unless he seriously hurts VK, Haye is going to get hit. Ask Herbie Hide how that worked out.

Finally, Haye does not have good footwork. His reach isn't the same as VK's. His being able to maintain a strong pace for 12 rounds against a much larger foe, I can't see that.

VK doesn't lose on points, he just doesn't. Even now, at this age.

If someone would have to catch someone, it would be Haye needing to catch VK. And with Haye's speed and VK's seeming slight decline, Haye just may be able to do that. I doubt it, but I think there may be a glimmer of hope now where it didn't exist before, IMO.

 

Insightful post! Let's be more specific, though.[/quote]


Ok marciano is 60 lbs lighter looks faster because he is a lot smaller and would be destroyed by vit... any clearer... same way a light heavy would be faster but would be destroyed.. a good big man defeats a good small man!

 

not a chance:smoke

 

Go watch the mock fight if you want to see how shaky his chin is... a fighter who was a 160lber most of his career...

 

I hope the fight happens. I really do. I hope Don King doesn't get options on Haye if he beats Valuev, because if King does, then the fight likely won't come off.

Haye does not have good footwork, particularly as regards defense. There is no way in God's earth that a blown up CW that was dropped by a former SMW (Lolenga Mock) is going to muscle VK. Which means that Haye would have to be able to dance and move, at times, over the course of 12 rounds or else take punishment. I just can't see that. Maybe he could eat some of VK's shots and be ok. But after watching grazing shots from Barrett bother him, I'm not sure that would happen.

Arreola is a totally different physical specimen than Haye. Haye could not fight like Arreola did and survive with VK as long as Arreola did. I don't think Haye has the will to do that, either, because he knows his chin won't hold up, even against someone without big 1-punch power like VK.

The more I think about it, the less chance I think Haye has. Yes, VK has slipped, but the matchup heavily favors him against a smallish HW like Haye.

I'll say this: If Haye couldn't get VK's respect fairly early, VK would run over him. I think Haye probably could, with his combo of speed and power, but if he could not then the fight would be over very fast. Vitali is a bully, and he likes to destroy people. If he felt he could walk through Haye he would and he wouldn't wait long to do it.

Let's hope the fight happens. First Haye needs to beat Cro-Magnon Man and then, hopefully, he can do so without owing Don King anything.

Haye has to be encouraged by what he saw tonight. If he really wants to fight both K Bros to maximize his $$$, then he should go for VK as soon as he beats Valuev, if he does.

 

Hey, man, let's hope the fight comes off. I agree with you, Haye would probably have to fight like you say to have a chance. I think he would have to try to end it, but that's probably not realistic. So, in reality, he would likely have to fight the bout you think he would need.

I don't think Haye could do that, but you never know. Let's hope we get to find out!

:good:bbb:good

 

I would rate Vitali about 18th to 25th on an all-time basis. I'm not arguing with you there. And yes, I agree that a prime Lewis, Holyfield, Louis, Ali, Tyson, Holmes, Liston, and other greats would beat Vitali.

But still, these guys who could beat Vitali are very elite fighters. It would probably take nothing less than a truly great figher to have overcome Vitali.

I totally disagree with you that Vitali is only a "little better" than Carnera and Willard. Vitali has a big edge on both guys.

Vitali is not the fastest or most agile heavyweight of all time, as you point out, but he is extremely effective because he makes the most out of his physical advantages. Vitali uses his awkwardness to devastating effect.

It is very, very easy to underrate Klitschko. He is deceptively effective, though. Remember that when Klitschko fought Herbie Hide in 1999, the English bookmakers actually rated Hide as a 40-1 favorite (you read that right...40-1). This was because the bookies saw the same things in Vitali that you mention in your posts: slowness, clumsiness, low held hands, supposed vulnerability to superior fast moving boxers with heavy punching power, etc. What happened, though? Vitali blew Hide away in two rounds. Easy.

Your assessment of Haye's superiority over Vitali sounds very much like what the English bookmakers said concerning Hide's alleged superiority over Vitali in 1999.