Froch vs Dirrell - I hope all of you so called boxing experts get shut the %u@k up

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Solid Chin, Oct 13, 2009.


  1. Solid Chin

    Solid Chin Concrete Wars Full Member

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    I am sick and tired of hearing things like this about Dirrell:

    1. He is too Green
    2. He has never gone 12 round championship distance
    3. How will he cope with the crowd
    4. Froch will wear him down late and stop him like he did Taylor
    5. Dirrell does not have the power to hurt Froch
    6. Dirrell's heart and chin has not been untested

    Let me answer all of the points I have made because I am getting pissed off with you so called boxing experts giving this kid no chance in winning, I have been listening to alot of the predictions and everybody sees Froch wearing him down late. Is it just me or are most Americans in some kind of trance. Froch was almost beaten by Taylor, a well known American fighter who in effect beat himself in that fight with a bit of help from Froch wearing his ass down but in effect Taylor threw it out the window in the same way he did against Pavlik.

    1. He is too Green

    Granted, he has not fought a name as yet but what is a name, for instance, just because Morales beat Pac but then loses to Zahir Raheem, what exactly did beating a name say about Morales, he still lost to Zahir Raheem in his next fight so my point is this, stop watching records and names and look at the fighters talent. At some point a Green fighter has to step up to the plate but most statements I hear are from people predicting a Froch win when they have never even seen a Dirrell fight, if that is not stupid then I dont know what is. Go and watch Dirrell on good quality recorded DVD's not ****ing youtube, you miss things when you watch youtube clips and you miss the subtle things done in the ring.

    2. He has never gone 12 round championship distance

    This is a valid point and one that is very important, however the same was being said of Amir Khan before he fought Kotelnik but with the right conditioning training and simulated sparring he was able to go the distance even if he tired in the last 2 rounds, he still grinded out the victory using his boxing skills which is what won him the fight. The difference being Kotelnik was not a noted puncher but Khan pretty much shut him out. Froch will find it hard to actually get inside on Dirrell especially if he is in the middle of the ring due to Dirrell's jab and his laser fast punches and counters, watch Dirrell vs Stevens and you will see him stop his opponent from wanting to open up in fear of getting countered, he took away Stevens only weapon which was power through effectively using the ring and setting up Stevens who came in and got countered by straight lefts all night, he was disheartened in the 2nd part of the fight and could not find an answer. In this fight he also went a comfortable 10 rounds without even remotely looking tired. He paced himself very well, Froch is not a pressure fighter he is a counter puncher and he only applies pressure sparringly so dont get it twisted.

    3. How will he cope with the crowd

    Like any other fighter with talent handles the crowd, they become invisible once the actual fight starts because your not focusing on the crowd, you are in the zone and your opponent is the main focus. When you have another man on the other side of the ring looking to take your head off the crowd becomes insignificant once the fight starts. If anything Froch needs to worry about trying not to please the crowd too much because he will without a doubt run into a bomb because his defense leaves alot to be desired. My prediction is, if the crowd is booing then Dirrell is fighting the right type of fight. He does not need to mix it up with Froch early doors. The 2nd part of the fight will be the time to mix it up after he has taken Froch out of his gameplan through frustrating him with sharp counters and movement.

    4. Froch will wear him down late and stop him like he did Taylor

    This is the comment that defies logic. Dirrell and Taylor and 2 completely different fighters and it is a fact that Taylor got tired in that fight and according to his doctor he lost weight too fast which contributed to this sudden lathargic feeling in the latter part of the fight. I think Dirrell will already know what strengths Froch has and he fully well knows Froch is a strong finisher so I am pretty sure that as a professional boxer he is not going to blow his wad in the 1st 5 or 6 rounds of the fight to only get himself Taylor'ed at the end, it is not going to happen, Dirrell is going to be doing something Taylor didn't, he will be using the ring and giving Froch different angles. Froch will find it hard to string combinations together because when someone is moving back it takes away the other mans ability to throw effective combinations and it leaves that man open if he tries to. Dirrell is going to counter Froch with straight lefts and if he starts landing over hand rights it could be a short night. A way past his best Robin Reid had Froch in trouble in the 4th round of their fight with a wild right hand which found the target so easily. Froch did not know what to do and looked lost and If Dirrell has him in a similar position the fight will be over.

    5. Dirrell does not have the power to hurt Froch

    This is the mistake that most of these experts seem to be making. Dirrell has stopped his last 5 or 6 opponents no matter what you say about his level of opposition he stopped them. If he chooses to put them together and sit down on his shots he can get Froch out of there, do not be fooled by his style of fighting. He does have pop but he is a boxer not a slugger. He breaks fighters down just like Mayweather does, he will break you down and then controls the fight. Froch will be getting hit alot and he will not see alot of the shots coming, at first he might be potshotting on Froch but after he finds that he is able to land on Froch at will then he will set up home runs and start landing them. The job Taylor started will be finished by Dirrell.

    6. Dirrell's heart and chin has not been untested

    I think his chin and heart has been tested and the knockdown he suffered to Rocha was a mistake he made and he got caught with a counter right on the money as he was coming into the punch and the guy who caught him was not slow. Dirrell since then has learnt from that mistake and he continues to learn. For those who think he was knocked down against Hanshaw, no he wasn't, study the tape properly. Both times you will see exactly what happened, with the 2nd being a tangle of feet and the 1st a case of nowhere to go but downwards due to the man right ontop of him, he avoided the incoming by ducking down and was assisted down by Hanshaw's forward momentum. When he got up he countered the **** out of Hanshaw, even to the point where I saw a straight left counter that almost gave Hanshaw whip lash LOL

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    I think most can see that I am picking Dirrell to win the fight and after all is said and done he will shut all of these so called boxing experts up and then everybody can start looking at things in a different light. In my opinion America has embraced Froch but in typical American fashion you are now thinking of him as some kind of beast, he beat Pascal and he beat Taylor but now he is facing a guy who actually has more ring smarts than both to completely frustrate Froch and I am putting everything on the line to say Dirrell will shine and this will be his coming out party.

    May the best man win...:good
     
  2. Maxime

    Maxime Sweet Science Full Member

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    The first 3 points are legit concerns.

    Dirrell is green, he also has never fought 12 rounds and he's never walked into an opponents backyard with a huge hostile crowd.

    We'll know saturday if any of that will have an effect. If it does not. It won't mean people who pointed those things out are not "boxing experts". It will just mean Dirrell was able to overcome those things.

    This is boxing. You could come up with the best analysis of all time based on nothing but cold hard facts. Based on a long debate with 20 of the most knowledgeable boxing people of all time and you could still be dead wrong.

    That's the beauty of boxing.
     
  3. Cobbler

    Cobbler Shoemaker To The Stars Full Member

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    Most of this obviously is just rehash of your previous posts, so I'm not going to repeat myself in response.

    I'm interested in point two, and your comparison with Amir Khan. It's is, as you note, a valid point of concern over Dirrell that he has never been twelve rounds. Your reply seems to be of the nature that if Khan can do it, so can Dirrell. However, a point of interest that you con't seem to have picked up on. Khan is trained by arguably the best boxing trainer in the world. Dirrell is trained by his grandfather.

    Dirrell doesn't just have his own top level inexperience to deal with in this fight and the build up to it, but also that of his supporting team. If I were backing him, that would actually be the point I would be most concerned about. Are his training team telling him the right things, have they prepared him the right way, will they know enough to give him the right advice. I don't think this is a point that many people have considered.
     
  4. konaman

    konaman Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Although Froch - Dirrell is clearly going to be a very competitive fight, probably with Dirrell taking the majority of the early rounds, you Dirrell fans cannot ask for "objectivity" when you don't show any yourself. Dirrell has plenty of major flaws in his game, he isn't a great technical boxer, and his natural athletic gifts probably aren't going to carry him past opponents with good punch resistance on their own.

    Too many Dirrell fans have absolutely no idea at all and confuse hand speed and superior athleticism with technical prowess. Dirrell has many major flaws, offensive and defensive. This thread is also pretty stupid considering Dirrell isn't even that big of an underdog in the actual boxing community which is astounding considering he has never fought a top 15 fighter.
     
  5. elguapo

    elguapo Well-Known Member Full Member

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    good post!!!:good
     
  6. tolindoy

    tolindoy UBESTRIDTE MESTER Full Member

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    those 6 concerns are true, they are not just made up...it is up to dirrell to prove people wrong, thats how great fighters are made..

    Until then, those 6 concerns stays..:good
     
  7. Solid Chin

    Solid Chin Concrete Wars Full Member

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    The points I blew up and highlighted is things I want to correct you on and to stop you right in your tracks.

    I did not say if Khan can do it Dirrell can do it, I stated if you actually read properly that if you have the right conditioning and simulated sparring then the 12 round distance should not be so much of a major point of concern.

    The second point you made is completely stupid and irrelevant more so to the fact that you made yourself sound un intelligent by stating this opinion.

    Freddie Roach trains Penalosa, did Penalosa beat Lopez,
    Freddie Roach trained De La Hoya, did De La Hoya beat Mayweather
    Freddie Roach trained Hopkins, did Hopkins beat Calzaghe

    Do you want me to carry on, your logic is completely fickle and full of holes...

    Who was Roy Jones trained by all those years
    Who is Paul Williams trained by
    Who was Shane Mosley trained by

    Now answer your own failed opinion after I have pointed out all the holes in your stupid comparison.

    Dirrell's grandfather is not the one in the ring taking the punches, he is there to prepare his fighter to be the best he can be and so far it has not done him any harm yet so where do you get off with saying this about Dirrell's trainer. It is a stupid point to make and it just shows me how fickle minded you really are. Freddie Roach is not only a good trainer he is a good matchmaker so dont be fooled son, he knows how to match his fighters and if you dont know this then you need to take your head out the sand.
     
  8. Ramón

    Ramón Guest

    I agree. Dirrell hasn't even fought a top 25 fighter yet. Hanshaw, the best fighter he fought, gave him some trouble too. It doesn't look good for Andre. All those six concerns are valid. My biggest concerns are his lack of experience, which translates into making plenty of wrong decisions, his lack of power given his fighting style, and his toughness/chin.
     
  9. K2ray

    K2ray Well-Known Member Full Member

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    :good

    Those who use the above reasoning are simply delusional English patriots of the HattonBot kind.
    ...the blueprint to the 'fearsome' british crowd is simple: the Haglar v Minter fight....I believe Dirrell will have the same focus (not to mention skills) to win this fight :bbb
     
  10. K2ray

    K2ray Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I presume, you've based that on the blurred youtube clips you've seen:roll:
     
  11. Stickandmove

    Stickandmove Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Froch will perform better this weekend than against JT for several reasons

    1. Home crowd advantage - he was unsettled in Connecticut against JT
    2. No injuries leading up to this fight whereas he rolled his ankle 3 weeks before the JT fight
    3. The experience gained from the JT fight

    So, if Dirrell does pull this off he deserves all the credit in the world. It is a big ask.
     
  12. PrideOfWales

    PrideOfWales Winston Zedmore Full Member

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    Froch KO2 Dirrell

    Dirrell must have a shaky jaw, hasn't faced this level of comp before and I doubt Dirrell will be able to handle the crowd. He's too unproven.
     
  13. Stickandmove

    Stickandmove Well-Known Member Full Member

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    It could well happen. That would be disappointing as we're building up for a real battle royal here.
     
  14. Cobbler

    Cobbler Shoemaker To The Stars Full Member

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    I'm not really sure why you feel the need to resort to all the personal abuse. It seems to be affecting a lot of your posts recently, and to be honest I nearly didn't bother responding to your thread here because of your inability recently to respond to counterpoints dispassionately and logically. I probably shouldn't have bothered.

    Nobody is arguing that a fighter trained by Freddie Roach will automatically win a fight. Nobody is arguing that a fighter trained by someone related to them is automatically not going to suceed. Yet for some reason you feel the need to build up these strawmen arguments and then knock them down, rather than addressing the actual point made.

    The point is that, just as Dirrell is taking a big step up, so is his training team. Whenever anyone takes a step up there are question marks that need to be answered. Those are unknowns in this fight and the fact that they are unknown should be considered in any analysis.
     
  15. konaman

    konaman Boxing Addict Full Member

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    You could probably find flaws (just like you could with nearly any fighter) in any 30 second clip of him from anywhere in his career. The fact that you are implying that he isn't notably flawed just shows how stupid you are. I don't have a problem with Dirrell, he has his positives and negatives and is an exciting prospect, be it totally unproven, but some of you guys are at the least partially ******ed.