The effectiveness of Aikido

Discussion in 'MMA Forum' started by rekcutnevets, Nov 29, 2009.

  1. rekcutnevets

    rekcutnevets Black Sash Full Member

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    There's a lot of questions as to whether or not Aikido is effective. I studied Aikido briefly. I have no doubt the wrist locks that I learned are effective in certain situations. I have little belief that someone could actually catch an opponents punch in mid strike to apply such locks.

    There are also throws and the use of redirection that I feel to be effective.

    Sparring and competition are often said to go against the basic philosophy of Aikido. Though certain people dispute this.

    I happened across a few videos the other day. I don't believe the one handed Aikido practitioner to be the 2nd coming of Royce Gracie, but I wonder how much his art could progress with further experimentation like this:

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLqovX4G8Z0&feature=related[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwt9_G6VcME&feature=related[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYQMhRsNtE4&feature=related[/ame]


    Because whenever I see something like this:

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHEhfy9eLLo&feature=related[/ame]



    I can't help but be reminded of this:

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_vvI26NnwE[/ame]
     
  2. Beebs

    Beebs Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    It's great when the other guy is cooperating with you.
     
  3. chuffy

    chuffy ESB Hall Of Fame Member Full Member

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    Very interesting read, Rekcutnevets. Thanks for the videos too. :good:good
     
  4. ufoalf

    ufoalf Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Not sure, but these video's show an one armed Aikido guy vs an amateur(at best) MMA fighter. Not to mention open hand strikes and some weird rules. Can't really judge by these videos.
     
  5. rekcutnevets

    rekcutnevets Black Sash Full Member

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    The point I was trying to make is that typical Aikido practice is done like the 4th video in my post, and that is about as real as it gets. I wonder how much Aikido can progress, if you're of the opinion that it can, with more competitive settings.
     
  6. achillesthegreat

    achillesthegreat FORTUNE FAVOURS THE BRAVE Full Member

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    I've been thinking about this alot recently and I've been doing a bit of studying on it.

    Basically, the basic ideology behind Aikido is incredibly effective. Using one's strength/momentum against them. Past that I feel it becomes INCREDIBLY ineffective and fanciful. It could be applied on your average joes but past their basic moves that are effective i.e. wrist locks, it becomes an incredibly ineffective martial art.
     
  7. Chaney

    Chaney Mystery and Imagination Full Member

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    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afi7_01GnxY[/ame]


    Sorry for derailing the thread.

    The Jim Carey sketch reminded me of this Monty Python take on self defense.

    "But suppose somebody comes at you with a pointed stick?"
     
  8. chimba

    chimba Off the Somali Coast Full Member

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    I took Aiki for over 10 years, I gave up because there where too much BS. I was with Tenshin Aikido, to this day the only legit Aiki school in the world. I use to attend Aiki seminars and Seagal and his crew would ****in laugh at some of the techniques from these Old Japanese men and these Euro practicioners. He would disrespect them flat out. I understand him, I mean people would ****in jump w/o being touched. Also they have become addicted to all these Chi "Ki" talk, students would practically go into convulsions without being touched lol its a ****in joke.

    In saying that, the basic principles of it is sound (Daiti Ryu) or how OSensei intended it to be. Its Newasa standing up basically. People will laugh and I understand but Seagal is probably the realest practicioner of Aikido, too ****in bad the man is crazy and Im not going into details.
     
  9. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Ever heard of Tomiki Aikido? Weird ruleset, but they train against resisting opponents who are trying to win. Conventional Aikidoka attack these guys on Youtube pretty regularly for being unskilled and using "strength instead of technique".

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PQpI4Ss0tY[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dA0XACGbY[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slmHJdbNdak[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSLzoIhSsPs[/ame]

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ck61s5GeOYU[/ame]
     
  10. Beebs

    Beebs Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I hadn't, and didn't mean to disrespect the few, but the majority of Akido is two men dancing; ponytails heavily encouraged.

    What are the rules? It appears to restrict the grips available, but outside of that similar to judo. Maybe the grips aren't restricted and they just like arm on arm, which has it's merits.

    Apparantly it has 2 forms; one which is similar to judo but restricts grabbing the gi, the other is one has a stick representing a knife and attacks the other, then they switch.
     
  11. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    No offense taken, naturally. (I'm not even an Aikidoka, and generally agree with your assessment of non-resisting training if it's indulged in for too long).

    As for the rules, I'm not entirely sure; it's limited to the traditional Aikido throws and locks, and I believe it restricts grabs on the gi except for the sleeves. Sparring is done against a "knife" (dowel-ish thing) wielding opponent, who is trying to score points by stabbing you.
     
  12. Beebs

    Beebs Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    It is under Shodokan Aikido in Wiki, there is the judo with no gi gripping kind and the simulated stabbing kind. I think they are seperate events, but they could also be two parts of the same competition.
     
  13. Koa

    Koa Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Took some as a kid. All we learned were counters to strikes, into submissions.. The thing was, however practical many of the moves were, you really either needed an opponent to really telegraph a strike, be literally helping you submit them, or you would have to see things in slow motion and be incredibly fast.

    The cool thing about Aikido was learning how to fall and roll in such a way to avoid most damage.
     
  14. chimba

    chimba Off the Somali Coast Full Member

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    I agree. Breakfalls help bone density, no doubt. But i tell you rolling on concrete is tough let alone breaking a judo throw.

    The problem with joint locks and manipulations are just like you said, you are either faced with a stationary combatant or someone whos really just incompetent in fighting. The best Aiki techniques are against a rushing adversary that you can use the momentum to throw against a wall, doing irimi, sayonage, parrying all that.

    Also Tenshin basically (Seagals Aikido) although he himself doesnt recognize it taught more strikes than grappling which is why I believe its more effective.
     
  15. achillesthegreat

    achillesthegreat FORTUNE FAVOURS THE BRAVE Full Member

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    Van Damme says he offered Seagal out at Stallones house party. Seagal never turned up after two hours. Van Damme says Seagal was disrespectful.