Joe Frazier vs. Superheavyweights

Vitali has been down once, when he got clocked by a fat golfer - same thing happened to his lover/brother in case you missed it.

He's fought a collection of bums and lost the only 2 meaningful fights he's been involved in, that's the facts. Of course you'll come back with spin about rounds won, KO percentages, how tall he is etc but the cold hard truth is he's fought 2 good fighters and lost both times - and that's how he'll be remembered. Comparisons with Joe Frazier are ridiculous because Frazier fought the greatest HW that ever lived, and beat him.

 

:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

I notice you pick up on Fraziers bad defences and ignore the fact that he defended against 2 all time top 5 heavies in between those fights. Now lets compare fat-ass Danny Williams to those guys Frazier defended against......doesn't look so bad now does it?

You really do talk utter bollocks at times my friend, and your pathetic Klit love knows no bounds, obviously.

 

What absolute anti-intellectual bull****. There is a prevailing orthodoxy present here which entirely over-praises certain eras and undervalues the present, over-praises the unseen, the un-cataloged and under-reported over the well-documented and invasively analyzed.. So, we are all supposed to be simpletons and follow along like sheep?

I don't know. I have 30 or so years experience in this sport and think a lot of people here are just repeating stupid **** they have heard biased, misinformed commentators foment in the past. **** this nonsense. You can have it.

 

All hail the mighty Seamus!

 

Yes, the man has the greatest defense in HW history and he has the nerve to compare his title defenses to Vitali. The win against Ali is tenfolds to everything Vitali has done, including "Winning the event" against an overweight, old, past-prime Lennox Lewis.

 

Good point..make you wonder "the bigger they are the harder it is to get the Fork up"

 

Thats because Jerry Quarry owned Mac, I was in the garden that night and Quarry owned Mac and Frazier beat Quarry 2 times...If Frazier avoided fighters like Larry Holmes did during his rein and gave guys like Foreman enough time to get picked off instead of fighting anyone worthy he may have been Champ longer but his style mandates a short prime

 

Excuses! Frazier was down a few times in a short amateur career, including once in the Olympics, and 11 times as a pro. Spin away, he never had a great chin. Vitali only faced one sizable heavyweight? Pffft! I suppose Peter, Arreola, or Johnson don't count.

 

Frazer only meet Foreman as champion, and he got canned worse than any ATG I can think of. Unless you consider the NY state championship a champion something, Frazier was not the champion in his other matches vs Foreman or Ali.

You don't seriously consider Frazier a champion before he meet Ali do you?

Again, Frazier had three title defenses as champion. Two were vs journeyman at best ( and he did not look good in one, and got his knees buckled in the other ), and one he got creamed.

Frazier was 1-4 vs Ali and Foreman, and down a few times vs. lesser talents in a relatively short career, which as I pointed out was a career where he meet 1 dangerous heavyweight puncher in Foreman.

Again, I think most top 25 heavies can go 1-4 vs Ali and Foreman, particularly when Foreman and Ali were well past their best in their last fights with Frazier.

Oh--And though I have not seen the film ( And I doubt most have here ), Frazier might have been given a gift decision over Scrap Iron Johnson. Not sure, but I hear it was a close one in the ring, but not on the judges score card.

Since some here are very reluctant to agree with facts, it makes me question their intellectual honesty, which is something that greatly differs from an opinion.

 

Correct. The performance was an absolute embarrassment to the most prize possession in sports. Frazier was a horrible athlete. As I said before, Futch said Frazier had the worst body of any heavyweight champion.

I also agree with Bert Sugar comment that boxing is best judged in the ring, not on other courts. Still, not being able to press 90 pounds once when the others in the competition did underscores a lack of physical strength.

You won't find crotch jockeys like Pete agreeing to known facts, Seamus.

 

What an absurb series series of comments v.s. Frazier ... the b.s. about his chin is pathetic. 11 knockdowns suffered but eight were in two fights to Foreman who had the power to crush anyone.

The Superstars as a barameter of Joe's strength ? What crap. Joe was a boxer who never trained with weights in his life. The event, in which he competed against trained professional athletes from many sports, almost all of which have strength trainers and exposure to weights. Frazier walked in with no experience and zero form and blotched it. Now some here are saying he was weak? If so, you know nothing. Frazier's exceptional strength was in his legs and trunk. Prior to Foreman it was more than enough to dominate a division.

Seamus: Valid point but there is also another position. Some think the world has peaked with the mechanical and highly flawed Klitkchko Brothers, as if their size makes up for their glaring weaknesses as fighters. Believe it or not men existed from fifty and eighty years ago that could have exposed both as not invincible.

As always, so much would depend on the particular match up and the conditions like ring size and referee ..