Marciano's Thoughts on Sonny Liston

Good post...Thing people forget is that Charles(who was a excellent Heavyweight had 2 explosive Ko's over Satterfield and Wallace

Moore was on his best win streak and dominated the 2 # 1 Heavyweight contenders and also beat the likes of great Harold Johnson and many of the best top Heavys and was a dangerous puncher and boxer

Walcott would not be one to pick to fight for a title but there was one champ. Its like Kelly Pavlick made the mistake of fighting B-Hop but Walcott was a puncher as well. That version of Walcott would upset a lot of Champs and ATG's

People call call them old but they were the best and beat all the Young Big men in the division and Marciano fought his # 1 contender 5 times out of 6. Marciano fought his # 2 contender after his nose injury to Charles but other than that did not pick the easy fights.

 

Another thing you are right about, Marciano did have 4-5 fight left in him but grew to hate Al Weil and felt he was being robbed. Marciano was going to make a comback but after realizing that Weil was connected well in the boxing world and legally there was no way he could come back minus Al Weil and I think that was the major reason to get out of the game. Cus D'mato said he would have kept Patterson away from Marciano had Rocky not retired and Patterson just came off a loss to Maxim, Sonny Liston had about 8 fights at the time and Valdez lost to Moore and then dominated by Satterfield...There were no real money fights left at that time. I think he should have had one more fight 50-0 with 44KO's would have looked good. Valdes was in line for # 50 but the loss to Moore and Satterfield and the fact that Nino took a 9 count at the end of the fight took away any luster that fight would have had.

 

:huh

Who compared Moore's punching power to Liston's? Different debate entirely. I was responding to your outlandish suggestion that Moore had somehow lost punching power by the time he faced Maricano when he was knocking out big top 10 heavies going into the fight. So maybe I'm not the one who should be pulling his head out of his ass.

Same goes for Walcott and Charles. Walcott had just won the title with the most devestating knockout of his career and Charles had just laid out a big 200+ lb top 10 heavy in Wallace with his left hook. If they didn't have enough power to knockout Marciano at the time they fought him, they never had it. Walcott has even been regarded by a number of his more experienced opponents as one of the hardest punchers they ever faced, harder than Joe Louis even. Walcott, Moore, and Charles threw some serious leather and at the very least, still had their power when they faced Marciano.

 

Very indicative of Rocky's fighting spirit and pride....which is what made him special.

 

I believe Rocky saw into Liston and had him, on that level, well pegged.

 

Marciano is an illusory subject. I have at-times been taken with his small stature but his record indicates that he paid his dues and then some. By the time he was champ, the top names had managed ratings for themselves. Marciano climbed up tough to get to the pinnacle of a division that was tougher than it looked, the age of some of the contenders be damned.

Today?

Well, Marciano was actually FAR smarter than he came off. His ring intelligence has to be considered VERY high. He was, IMO, the MOST conditioned heavyweight champion EVER. He was a physical freak that was able to melt down to nothing yet be as strong as a guy of 220-230lbs. His chin was granite, his will and resolve absolutely beyond any question.

I used to think Liston/Marciano would resemble Foreman/Frazier. Not these days. I'm apt to believe that Marciano would have known how to give Liston cause for pause, and then knock him out.

If Marciano was around today he'd be the same animal with some additional armour, probably weighing in around 200lbs.....as a heavyweight. Guys like David Haye would take him lightly and be quickly stopped.

 

You aren't alone on this. How Liston seems to get rated among the top ten all-time heavyweight champs so often astounds me.

 

To continue on this topic, I suppose. But veer just a tad.

I honestly believe had Marciano fought guys like Ingo & Patterson in his career who would be higher praised, especially in terms of H2H. If he had fought them in his prime we would see how devastating he would've matched up against these types of fighters. Rocky would have torn Ingo apart inside of 4-5 rounds. And Patterson would got badly stopped against Rocky.

Rocky may have not fought a prime Ezzard Charles. But you have to remember it's these slick, technical counter puncher types that would've trouble him the most I think. Guys like Ingo and Floyd that go right at home are made to order for The Rock. People talk about the slugger to swarmer version of Rocky. It's true, Goldman never wanted the Rock to be down on the cards after Walcott I. But people make way too much of it. Rocky pitched a lot of punches to these slick defensive type fighters like what we see against Moore so they couldn't combat. Against a Patterson or Ingo he would take his time to deliberately slug it out. In this case it would end in a brutal KO... possibly something composed of a 1-2 punch combination that says lights out. Both could give it but never could take it like Marciano.

 

Yes, but Floyd going to box in the center and not go backwards. He'll go forwards like he did against Liston. His speed won't last. But a prime Rocky that fought Walcott... forget about it. Floyd has a terrible task against him here. Stylistically it's just bad news. Ingo is tailor made even more for Rocky.

 

I do not know how uch Rocky had left post Moore but I do think he was near the end. However, a prime Rocky would do a number on both Ingo and Floyd ... no doubt in my book ... Ingo inside of five and Floyd inside of nine ... both by KO ...

 

I think Rocky would have mauled Floyd and Ingo .....Without a doubt he was way to aggressive.....as for Sonny if Rocky survived the 1st and 2nd round assaults he would have beaten Sonny..i think that if Sonny couldnt penetrate Rocky iron chin by the end of round 2 then Rocky takes over because Sonny once stood up to ALA Clay seemed to break down.

 

:good

 

and that is the KEY