Tyson Above Holyfield - Can It Be Justified?

Lennox Lewis, another forgotten champion in a forgotten decade

 

I dont think it can be justified but all this chatter about Tyson not being a great fighter is a joke. :?

 

Although winning rematches and getting up off the canvas to turn the tables is only part of the ingredients that makes greatness.

 

I'd like to correct myself. He's great but not great.

:good

 

He is great but not an alltime great.

 

Not an alltime great? 2 time HW champ, youngest HW champ, first one to unifiy the titles, only one to unifiy it by beating 3 different champions, beat 2 all time greats (one undefeated, one past his prime but far from done), defended his title 9 times and was very dominant for 4 years won the title again after spending over 3 years in prison and won it twice...not an all time great? :deal

 

atsch

...let's discredit Ali's status for relying on his freakish ability to take punishment past his prime while we're at it!

 

I only recognize my first three tiers (which are roughly the Top10) of each division as ATGs as I think this description is used far too often. Tyson is just outside my Tier 3 in the Tier 4, as are Dempsey, Langford and Wills.

 

If it's such an important part of legacy than why is Lennox routinely in top fives (including mine)

 

People says this a lot about Holyfield but consider this...

He went undefeated from 1984-1992. During this 8 years stretch he went 10-0 (7) in World Title fights. He was the Undisputed World Champ at CW and HW during this time. He did not lose a fight until after the age of 30.

He won his first World Title in only his 12th pro fight (vs. Hall of Famer Dwight Qawi). He did more in 28 fights than most fighters have ever done.

How was he inconsistent during his prime?

Sure after age 30 he lost a few, most of his losses came after age 35 though. He was 37 when he lost a close fight to a prime Lennox Lewis. Keep in mind he is still fighting at age 47.

Prime vs. Prime Holyfield beats every fighter he ever faced with the possible exception of Larry Holmes. I think a prime Foreman would have lost to a prime Holyfield in a great fight. The best versions of Bowe, Lewis, and Tyson lose to Holyfield at his very best IMO.

Many people get it twisted just because Holyfield stopped Tyson in '96. In '96 Holyfield was past prime. Holyfield rose to the occasion and did great but he was far from prime. Holyfield was able to fight in spurts and rest when he had to against the shorter "non-giant sized" Tyson. Vs. fighter like Bowe and Lewis Holyfield wouldn't have been able to do this.

The very best HW version of Holyfield was between 1989-1991 when he was beating the likes of Thomas, Dokes, Stewart, Douglas, and Foreman among others. When the Tyson fight fell thru (for the the November 8, 1991 date) Holyfield lost his hunger for a while.

 

Because Tyson only lost to ATG's, with the exception of Douglas who refused to fight him again. Douglas was the only guy that beat him when he was anywhere near his best, as well.
Lennox lost to McCall and Rahman... Basically two guys who he had less business losing to than Tyson against Douglas considering the form Buster was in.

 

I do consider Holyfield and Tyson all-time greats BTW.

 

Only dimwits don't.

 

Holyfield above Tyson on my list.

 

Who did Bowe, Lennox, and Moorer beat just prior to their wins over Holy?

So it's just my imagination that Tyson opened as a 25-1 favorite. :nut