What if Max Schmeling had been awarded the decision in the second Jack Sharkey fight?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by janitor, Jan 17, 2010.


  1. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    What if Max Schmeling had been awarded the decision in the second Jack Sharkey fight, as most contemporary newspapers thought he should have been?

    Would the era between the retirment of Gene Tunney and the rise of Joe Louis have panned out any differently?

    Schmeling was at least the most consistant of the champions of that era both in terms of both performence and work ethic.

    Could the number of champions of the 30s have been reduced significantly?
     
  2. TheGreatA

    TheGreatA Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I believe Schmeling should have been given the decision without any doubt (Sharkey did nothing), then again I felt Sharkey was getting the better of the first fight when Max seemingly acted his way out of it, although it wasn't me that was hit by that low blow...

    Either way he would have still lost to Max Baer soon after. Carnera? He would have had a chance of scoring an upset much like he did over a disinterested Sharkey. I believe the two were actually about to face each other in the very early 1930's although the bout never came off.
     
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Baer might have got the shot out of the gate actually.
     
  4. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Could we get a situation where Schmeling and Baer fight a trilogy and Sharkey, Carnera and Braddock simply get cut out of the picture?

    Alternativley, might Schmeling be the conduit for a different fighter having a spell as champion, who never held that distinction, such as Loughran or Hamas?
     
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    My personal opinion is that Baer is just the right man to beat Schmeling. He doesn't give a **** about the finer points of boxing, the points Schmeling trades on. Baer will just wade through him...of course, Schmeling being the general he was I don't rule out adjustments that make the second fight different to the real, but my pick would still be Max.

    That being the case I think Braddock, very much primed for the shot, would still land Max for the title. I don't see Schmeling taking the decision as a huge disruption to boxing history.

    Schmeling taking the title from Baer in a rematch is the wildcard. You then have to wonder how history would have panned out. Braddock might get taken out in the interim. I think Braddock was up to most challanges though. If Schmeling has the title at the end of 35 after his trilogy with Baer, however, Braddock might land Louis. He wasn't in a position to pick and chose. Louis takes him out, then matches Schmeling and is beaten. Louis probably doesn't get another shot until someone takes the title from Max - who would that be?
     
  6. My2Sense

    My2Sense Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Assuming Schmeling fought Carnera in his next defense as Sharkey did, I'd favor Schmeling to beat him.

    If Baer got his shot after that, then he'd win and we'd be back on the historical track.
     
  7. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    I have to agree with the majority here. I don't think that Schmeling was ever going to beat Max Baer, and weather or not he would have taken Carnera is subject to debate. Even though I consider Schmeling to be among the best of that early 30's crop, he simply was not destined to have a long extended reign...
     
  8. bodhi

    bodhi Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I disagree with these statements a bit. Their actual fight was about even before the KO. This beeing a one-sided trashing is a myth. So, with some adjustements I can see Schmeling beating Baer quite clearly.

    If Schmeling would have gotten the decision against Sharkey, like he would have deserved it, he would beat Carnera but would have to take on Baer some time in the futere. He would lose that one. There wouldn´t be a rematch due to Baer losing the title to Braddock. And then the history panning out like it did.
    The only difference would be that neither Sharkey nor Carnera would have been champs and Schmeling would have had a longer reing - and a slightly better resume I suppose. In the end Schmeling would have an argument to rank a bit higher all-time-wise but over all there would be no big changes.
     
  9. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    The problem with this statement is that it speculates on Schmeling beating Carnera. In any case, we are talking about a reign that when all is said and done, would have amounted to perhaps 2 years, starting from the time that he beat Sharkey to the point where Baer would have contended for the title, with perhaps 3 or 4 defenses in between. Hardly, what I'd call an extended reign.
     
  10. bodhi

    bodhi Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I never said he would have an extended reign. I actually said there wouldn't be much difference in history compared to how it really happened. The only difference would be that Carnera and Sharkey would never be champs and Schmeling might have a slightly better record and longer reign and so would rank slightly higher.
     
  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I don't say he was thrashed, or that he would be again. Just that Max Baer should be favoured to crash through based upon what we have on film.
     
  12. The Kurgan

    The Kurgan Boxing Junkie banned

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    I agree. I am certain that Max will not lose.
     
  13. bodhi

    bodhi Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Well, that´s where we differ then. I think the information we have on the career of both fighters and the film of their actual fight provides us with enough information to assume that Schmeling´s scientific workethic and Baer´s inconsistency would lead to a win for Schmeling in a second fight. Baer´s performance against Schmeling was his career best, he never did so well before or after only his win against Carnera comes somewhat close. On the other hand Schmeling´s performance against Baer was okay but he had better ones - Stribling, Walker, Louis, Neusel and so on. I don´t think Baer would repeat this performance while you can expect Schmeling to do so. That would spell trouble for Baer.