Frazier vs Holmes

I give a Goddamn, folks... I've got Frazier and Holmes on tapes galore, etc........ I know what both guys can do............ And Larry Holmes of 1978 to 1983 had all the tools and savvy to slice, dice and hammer a '69 / '70 Joseph Frazier all about the ring for a good decision win..... Holmes' jab is the best the division ever saw, and his right-cross deserved / demanded respect when it landed flush..... I also think Larry Holmes had better upper body strength, while Frazier gets the edge in the leg strength dept...... Still, I see Holmes as too skilled, savvy and quick with his hands and feet to lose to a pressuring J.F. who is merely looking to hook Holmes to death....... Holmes was also never a sucker for a left-hook; it was the counter right that caught Holmes a couple of times......... I'm sorry, Jack......... Holmes wins.........

MR.BILL

 

I see Frazier beating Holmes over 15.

 

Late in Joe's final pre peak fight, his rematch with Bonavena, Ringo did have some success boxing and retreating behind his jab. Again, Frazier only reached his peak as a result of getting those 15 hard rounds under his belt, but Larry was light years ahead of Oscar when at his best. At his best, did he have the legs to dance away from Frazier all night? Check out Holmes-Shavers I again. Could he sustain a fighting retreat for 15 rounds? Review the complete Cobb footage.

Again, Joe's bread and butter was his hook, but the hook was never Larry's Kryptonite. It comes down to who scores the most punches, and Holmes had the right hand to score over Smoke's cross armed defense, as well as that incessant jab. Unlike Ali, he'd either be moving to evade Frazier's hook to the body, or otherwise defending against it. Cooney's entire game plan was based upon getting his hook downstairs, to no avail. Would Joe really score with more punches than a Holmes who would never mimic Ali's punching bag against the ropes act?

When Smoke did connect, he was no Shavers in the power department (or even Cooney). He'd have to take Larry out to win. I don't see that happening. Nobody beat a prime Holmes through attrition, and it took a unique ATG boxing stylist to finally blemish his record. He twice dominated the super aggressive Shavers on the scorecards, certainly demonstrating his ability to deal with pressure, and Earnie was dedicating his two fisted attack to Larry's body both times.

Norton was dominated over the first ten rounds before the training injury to the Holmes left began to tell, and Kenny's hook and cross armed defense were somewhat reminiscent of Joe's. (Of course Ken didn't bring Joe's pressure, but then again, Frazier did not share the same caliber right hand Norton brought to the table.)

Of course this would be a hellish war for both. For me, Joe's a top five ATG HW, while Larry's among my top three.

 

Holmes jab is even more powerful than Ali's.......and for some reason he wasn't as vunerable to left hooks either (the right hand was Larry's bug-a-boo).

Could be "dark clouds" for Frazier.

 

Great fight ! The reason I tend to go towards Frazier, is styles make fights. Holmes jab alone, wouldn`t be enough to keep Smokin Joe off of him for all 15... You need bombs to keep Frazier off of you for a whole fight. He would bob and weave his way past some(but not all) of Holmes blistering jab. And work that body, following up with his signature left hook to the head. I`m talking about `Smokin` Joe 71` edition. Frazier UD or possible late rd TKO. Her I go, you could also make a case for Holmes 15 rd. UD But I`m sticking with Frazier... Tough fight the whole way...

 

Good fight...I like Joe...

 

Damn right, Frazier by UD if he doesn't stop Holmes late.

 

****in' A., Man......:good

MR.BILL

 

I think Holmes would beat him by close decision. Larry punched harder than Ali, and would punish Joe more on the way in. When Joe got inside, Larry had the powerful uppercut that he would be looking to rip into Joe.

Frazier on the other had was hard to hit with more than 1 or 2 punches at a time and was very good at getting to the inside quickly. When he got inside he would outwork Larry and dig his hook into Larry's ribs. Joe would also probably be able to drag Holmes into a few slugging matches, would work into Frazier's hands better.

All in all Larry takes it in a tough, close, and clear ud over 15 rounds.

 

I would put my money on Holmes too

 

If I had to bet, I'd go with Holmes. I'd be rooting for Joe but no. Realistically, I'd see it as an extremely grueling fight for both participants but Holmes was just too diverse and durable for me to think Frazier stops him and I simply don't see Joe outpointing him. Then again, some of Joe's most famous performances we can judge him from were not in his prime because of the eyes and other health concerns. And the best Larry fought in his prime was probably a faded Norton who pushed him to the limit. But Holmes was supposedly hurt going into that one. Okay, boys. I'm going to stop myself here because I sense I could go back and forth on this for about an hour.

 

I think this is a very close fight. I don't think Holmes is as good as pre-exile Ali, but I think he was better than any version of ALi that Frazier fought. As others have said, Holmes makes Joe pay on the way in, doesn't lay around and take punishment, and does some damage with an uppercut. Holmes for me.