the REAL atgs.

You two should get a room. :hey

 

Based on the names listed, you would probably have to add:

John L Sullivan
Peter Jackson
Jim Corbett
Bob Fitzsimmons
Sam Langford
Max Schmeling

Then the issue of the Klitschko brothers would have to be looked at when they retire.

So it is not easy to keep your list short.

 

Just whoever I feel has done enough, really. Not very formal about these things.

 

Precisely my point when I say its deceptively hard to keep a list short. Fitz and Langford I forgot mostly because I associate them with other divisions. Forgot John L Sullivan but hes a must. The others I would probably have borderline, I dont know enough about Peter Jackson.

 

I don't even bother to ask anyone else who are the greats or greatests anymore. Because I find that the biggest factor is almost always how popular the fighter is or was or both, whether people want to admit it or not. Then it gets to the point where I see guys sometimes picking their favorite fighters to easily beat the best H2H fighters of the last decade even in a time machine. That is too far from reality for my taste.

 

What are you saying? That fighters from the past ten years are better than any other?

 

Not any other. There are exceptions. But think about this. Try matching someone like Jersey Joe Walcott, a chain smoking sub 200 pounder, who is considered a great, against someone like a prime Vitaly, who is considered not great by many. If they both were at their same peak form at their eras, which of course would be a huge disadvantage for Walcott, would you honestly be comfortable putting your money on Walcott? Do the math.

 

That's one example. Carlos Monzon smoked. Would Pavlik beat him? Do the math.

 

Tunney?

 

No Schmeling? :bart

 

My list of ten only goes back to the Louis era and with the exception of Holy and your pre-Louis entrants, is identical to yours in names, if not order.

This means your list is pretty good.

 

I'm always amused that folks assume a newbie to ESB is a Newbie to boxing.