Heavyweight Boxing History With No Color Line

Correct. Smith no a white Hope. He was a top #1 or #2 contender while Johnson was champion. Supposedly Luther McCarthy had very good ability, but died in the ring. Not sure if Johnson would have picked McCarthy for a title shot if he was that much better than say Fireman Flynn, Frank Moran, or Jess Willard.

 

Why Gunboat Smith:huh:huh He wouldnt have beat Johnson no way.

 

Because he was on the same level as Jeanette. He got he beter of Johnson in a four round bout. Beat Langford, Moran, Willard. He is up there with Langford, McVey, Jeanette, Wills. At his best he would be good enough to beat any of them and win the title. Even so he would lose it the next fight or the fight after the next.

 

This was an exhibition during Johnson's training to fight Ketchel NOT A FIGHT .AD NAUSEUM.

Smith was indeed a White Hope ,and was briefly considered the best of them from the end of 1912 to1914 he had a good run ,which came to an end when he fouled out to Carpentier ,he then lost to Levinsky and was kod by Langford .Smith himself said after the ko loss to Langford, he went down hill fast.
Smiths peak coincided with Johnson's exile to Europe.
Anyone on here think Smith beats Johnson?

 

No but I never said Smith would win the title of Johnson.

 

I dont think Smith was as good as Jeanette,and dont think he would beat any of the black guys mentioned,His win over Langford was VERY debatable ,Langford kod him in 3rds a while later.
Smith could not beat 172 lbs Levinsky, or 170lbs Carpentier.and was shellacked by Jack Dillon.
Smith sparred with Johnson for Johnson's fight with Ketchel it was NOT a fight
Toxie Hall dropped Marciano.Greg Page dropped Tyson , would they be considered competitive with them in a real fight.?

 

My reply to you is lower down.

 

Global Transport Challenge??

 

The win he did get over Langford was controversial and he was kod in the rematch, he did have some good wins though but he also lost to alot of the good fighters too. His one fight with Willis he was blown out, He never fought Jack johnson i think you are cofusing him with Dempsey and he was kod fast in the rematch.

A good win was over Godfrey, but i also know that many of Godfreys losses were under suspicious circumstances.

 

We have to differ there than. I think Smith was on that level.

 

True he lost some fights to good fighters but so did Jeanette, McVey, Langford and Wills.

 

I dont necessarily agree with this.
I think Dempsey's inactivity was arguably the cause of his decline. If Dempsey had fought more often and trained accordingly he might well have lasted a few years longer.

 

Jackson should have had a shot in the late 1880's v.s. Sullivan and would likely have beaten John L. at that point, depending on the rules. He did not get to fight Corbett until he was already thirty. If Jackson won the title he would have dictated terms and not allowed a finish fight with the safety first Corbett. He also cold have delayed the bout when he fell from his horse and injured his leg, insuring he took the bout at 100 % .... I believe under these circumstances neither Corbett or Fitz beccome champ and an older , far more active Jackson loses eventually to a Jefferies in a much more brutal fight.

Johnson takes the title in an upset over Jeffries by decision in 06 and this eliminates Hart and Burns. Johnson fights Hart in a rematch and cuts him to ribbons and wins in a lopsied fashion.

Everyone talks about Dempsey ducking Wills but Willard did as well, in Wills prime. Wills would have succeed Johnson setting up a superfight with Dempsey while both were in their primes. Who wins that one I have no idea. Either way a prime Tunney comes in in 1926 and wins the title by decision over either man ....

 

Mate... I love your work. I see one problem, Jackson would have returned to Oz. His respects to Larry Foley would have seen a deserved Aussie fighter get a shot. After that, the Americans would make up another H/W title.. The Great American Hope.

 

Could very well be the case :good